River Decision.

hemstock · #1 08-04-2005, 06:37 PM

CO is Loose and Passive

PokerStars 0.25/0.50 Hold'em (10 handed) converter

Preflop: Hero is SB with A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 3[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img].
UTG calls, 3 folds, MP2 calls, MP3 calls, CO calls, 1 fold, Hero completes, BB checks.

Flop: (6 SB) J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 6[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (6 players)
Hero bets, BB folds, UTG folds, MP2 folds, MP3 calls, CO raises, Hero 3-bets, MP3 folds, CO caps, Hero calls.

Turn: (7.50 BB) 9[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (2 players)
Hero checks, CO bets, Hero calls.

River: (9.50 BB) 6[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (2 players)
Hero checks and hopes for a chance to raise?
Or does he bet and hopes for a raise?

How do you get the maximum when you are out of position on the river?

McGahee · #2 08-04-2005, 06:45 PM

I really don't know, I'd probably C/R, but I always whiff on these C/R attempts. Flush card + paired board can really scare a passive player. I would also throw up in my mouth if a passive player 3-bet my C/R here.

Here's one thing I do know - your flop 3-bet is gay.

hemstock · #3 08-04-2005, 06:47 PM

Why would you call my 3-bet on the flop "gay" ?

Disconnected · #4 08-04-2005, 06:51 PM

I would bet this against a passive player. The river card is scary, so he might not bet it, but I'd expect to get paid off from a Kx or Jx hand.

Why did you 3-bet the flop?

Henke · #5 08-04-2005, 06:53 PM

I think you're a dog here on the river. Most loose passives don't raise unless they beat top pair, which means two pair or better here. There are 9 possibilities for KJ, but 12 for K6 and J6. Also, he might have had a set on the flop. Because of this, I would check-call here.

About the flop 3-bet being "gay", what I think he ment was that you will probably not win by pairing the A, and hence you're "only" drawing to the flush. So you want more callers in case you hit to pay you off.

HentaiGaijin · #6 08-04-2005, 06:54 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Why would you call my 3-bet on the flop "gay" ?

[/ QUOTE ]

Because he doesn't have the vocabulary to use a more appropriate word.

I don't think you want to 3-bet here. You currently only have ace-high. You might 3-bet here if you had two overcards and a nut flush draw.

You risk pushing out the third player with your 3-bet, when you probably stand to make more money at the end if you make your flush and he stays in.

Henke · #7 08-04-2005, 06:54 PM

Is a passive player really passive if he caps the flop with Kx Jx, with x not being one of the other board cards?

madscratch · #8 08-04-2005, 06:57 PM

I think you have to bet the river. I'd much rather risk only having my bet called vs. having it checked through.

madscratch · #9 08-04-2005, 07:00 PM

[ QUOTE ]
I think you have to bet the river. I'd much rather risk only having my bet called vs. having it checked through.

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm retarted. Didn't see the full house with the 6. I now go to check call.

Redd · #10 08-04-2005, 07:01 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Why would you call my 3-bet on the flop "gay" ?

[/ QUOTE ]

I had this big joke lined up about making the 3-bet while having intercourse with a member of the same sex, but it turned out it was kind of lame so I'll just give a real response.

You make a teensy little bit of value if the 3rd guy calls, but he might not (and didn't) call 2 cold if you raise. You know you're probably not showing down UI, so I'd let him overcall and be part of the payoff parade when you do hit your flush. The odds that one guy has you reverse dominated, and will fold his hand are slim enough to not bother protecting your ace outs here IMO.

BTW, I lead the river sans read because that's a pretty scary card for Villain. If it didn't pair the board too, I'd be more inclined to c/r because Villain seems to like his hand, and here there's a not insignificant chance that you're still behind.

edit: Missed the read. I would bet-call on this river if CO is pretty passive; I think you're behind a good amount of the time if it's raised.