Getting Screwplayed...

[W. Deranged]

Wynn 15/30

The SB is a tricky player of moderate aggression. He's too loose and tends to cold-call too much pre-flop but plays solidly post-flop and is probably a decent winner in this game.

I've been running bad but playing a very solid game in my opinion. I've been put in a couple of very tough spots with overpairs and such. One notable hand involved me check-folding the river with AA (after much thought) after getting raised only once on the turn by a very passive player. (The hand accidentally flipped up and was exposed when I mucked it.) So my image may be important here.

It's folded to me in the CO and I open-raise with XY. (Read on and you'll see why I'm not disclosing my hand...). SB three-bets, I call, and the two of us take the flop.

Flop (~6.5 SB): Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 9[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 3[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img].

SB bets, I call.

Turn: 2[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]

SB checks, I bet, SB check-raises...

My question is basically: assuming I have no substantial draw to speak of (beyond possible pair or trips outs), what is the worst hand you could have which merits calling down here? Are there any hands which you call the turn and fold the river unimproved?

[Entity]

Kinda hard for me to say, as the majority of hands I'd be calling down with are hands that I would have very likely capped preflop or put in more flop bets with. I'd say I'm inclined to call down with QJs-ish here, maybe QTish. I'm not fond of putting in 3BB's on the turn+river with a middle pair.

Just as a general aside, with your image and your read on SB, you might want to consider capping preflop with XY. It's a good hand, especially when suited.

Rob

[goofball]

"SB is a tricky player of moderate aggression"

I check behind with almost every single hand with which I'm not going to want to 3bet a checkraise.

[DeathDonkey]

2 pair.

-DeathDonkey

Against an unknown I would call down with any queen, I would fold if i had JJ, or 9x.

However you said this player plays solid postflop this changes things significantly. IMO here is the hand range of a typical postflop solid player given the turn action. I would put him on AA,KK,QQ,99,33,22,AQ,KQ since he may 3bet preflop with all these hands. I dont think he can have a hand like QJ,JJ,TT or 9x since going for the checkraise would be too risky becuz there are too many bad river cards that can kill him in case you check behind, and plus he is also less likely to have the best hand relative to your range. I dont see him checkraising this turn on a draw either since he would most likely bet the turn and hope you fold since he has been the aggressor so far.

So against a solid postflop player I think you need to tighten up your calling down requirements significantly. The fact that he did see you fold Aces does complicate things, this fact should make you loosen up your calling down requirements. KQ is the minimum hand I would call down with in this situation against a solid postflop player.

Notice that KQ is the bottom of the range I put the solid player on, which means based on my read calling down with this hand doesnt make sense, but since he did see you fold aces, and theres always a 5-10% hes bluffing/semibluffing, and theres always a chance my read is wrong, calling down with KQ is acceptable IMO.

[W. Deranged]

Thanks guys...

My hand was A9. I folded after a bit of thought mainly because of the image issues. I started thinking about the hand it occured to me that I probably would have called down with most Q's I would have opened/stealed with (like QTo and better). And then I realized that's inconsistent, because there basically are so few reasonable hands that A9 isn't beating that QT is...