Havent posted one of these in a while (a-high screwplay)

NLSoldier · #1 12-01-2005, 04:33 PM

Party Poker 10/20 Hold'em (6 max, 4 handed) FTR converter on zerodivide.cx

Preflop: Hero is UTG with Kd, As.
Hero raises, Button calls, 1 fold, BB calls.

Flop: (6.50 SB) 2c, 7s, 5s (3 players)
BB checks, Hero bets, Button calls, BB folds.

Turn: (4.25 BB) 2d (2 players)
Hero checks, Button bets, Hero raises, Button calls.

River: (8.25 BB) 9h (2 players)

What do you guys this is best river plan here? My usual when i use this move is check/fold, but this board was really nice so check/calling and value betting are options as well imo.

TStoneMBD · #2 12-01-2005, 04:47 PM

screwplay means you bet flop and checkraise turn? i like that play alot. not here though.

after he calls your turn raise i would check the river. alot of players will check behind with small pairs and PPs because they think youre a total donkey double checkraising a big pair. i dont think a bet has much value. id rather him check behind.

Spicymoose · #3 12-01-2005, 04:51 PM

Wow. I have never used the screwplay, nor fully understood it. I think this is an excellent time to do it on the flop. When people cold call, a huge portion of their range is usually high cards. They also can't resist betting the turn after you check, so I think this is great. As for the river, once he calls your turn check raise, I would guess he probably has a small PP, but maybe he still has overcards. I would just check/call.

NLSoldier · #4 12-01-2005, 04:53 PM

[ QUOTE ]

after he calls your turn raise i would check the river. alot of players will check behind with small pairs and PPs because they think youre a total donkey double checkraising a big pair. i dont think a bet has much value. id rather him check behind.

[/ QUOTE ]

yep this is my reasoning for checking being my default river plan after a screwplay.

sthief09 · #5 12-01-2005, 04:58 PM

bet the turn. given that you didnt, value bet the river

sthief09 · #6 12-01-2005, 04:59 PM

[ QUOTE ]
screwplay means you bet flop and checkraise turn? i like that play alot. not here though.

after he calls your turn raise i would check the river. alot of players will check behind with small pairs and PPs because they think youre a total donkey double checkraising a big pair. i dont think a bet has much value. id rather him check behind.

[/ QUOTE ]

they never seem to have a problem value betting me. i think he gets paid off by A high plenty often

Wynton · #7 12-01-2005, 05:30 PM

I'm not sure I see the point of the screw play here. Is this for value or to get a better hand to fold?

If villain has some kind of mediocre pair, I think that screw play might get him to check the river, but probably not fold the hand.

If villain has as worse Ace, isn't it better just to lead the turn and, perhaps the river also?

Spicymoose · #8 12-01-2005, 05:34 PM

[ QUOTE ]
I'm not sure I see the point of the screw play here. Is this for value or to get a better hand to fold?

If villain has some kind of mediocre pair, I think that screw play might get him to check the river, but probably not fold the hand.

If villain has as worse Ace, isn't it better just to lead the turn and, perhaps the river also?

[/ QUOTE ]

If villain has a PP, he may fold on the turn, but it isn't all that likely. The times he does is great though. Lots of times we extract an extra BB from overcards who would have folded to our turn bet. Occasionally we might even get high cards to call our check raise, and then bluff us at the river.

NLSoldier · #9 12-01-2005, 05:41 PM

[ QUOTE ]
I'm not sure I see the point of the screw play here. Is this for value or to get a better hand to fold?

If villain has some kind of mediocre pair, I think that screw play might get him to check the river, but probably not fold the hand.

If villain has as worse Ace, isn't it better just to lead the turn and, perhaps the river also?

[/ QUOTE ]

when I do it im pretty much never trying to get a better hand to fold cuz that pretty much never happens. like spicymoose said, it often extracts an extra bet out of overcards that would have folded to the turn bet, and sometimes 2 extra bets because they call out of frusteration. another reason that i occasionally do it with ace high is because i will fairly often do it with very strong made hands.

TStoneMBD · #10 12-01-2005, 05:48 PM

i like doing screw plays on boards where the opponent pretty much has to have a pair by calling a flop bet or i know hell bet the turn. on this ragged flop hes peeling with any overcards and alot of players are going to check the turn. i really dont like the screw play here it serves no purpose imo.