Donked by a 2+2er

[Wynton]

This hand requires thought because you say the sb is a very good player.

Given that, the only hands I can put sb on include a King (with either a straight or flush draw). Without accounting for metagame or table image considerations, I think a fold is best. But if you're determined to see what sb has, then I believe you should be raising, to eliminate the weak player who could easily be drawing.

[StellarWind]

I started by agreeing with you completely and I'm sure I would have raised the turn.

But on further reflection raising is incorrect. He checkcalled the flop. It's certainly possible to checkcall the flop and bet the turn with A6 or something, but not after a king hits. There are no hands without a king that checkcall the flop but bet this turn. If his hand wasn't worth a flop checkraise it certainly isn't worth a bet now unless he improved.

It's unlikely a strong 2+2 would play mind games with a third player in the pot.

You may wish to play on in hopes that this analysis is wrong for some reason. Maybe it's an odd bluff or some sort of strange play. But mostly you are chasing with two outs and far from winning even if SB is not ahead of you. There could be a king behind you and they probably have a lot of outs when you are ahead.

So you either trust your read and fold or you call down because your hand is decent and you have two outs. But you have no business putting extra money in the pot or risking your outs. Your winning chances simply aren't good enough to worry about pushing the third player out. Your chances of saving the pot by raising are miniscule and if you do spike a jack you'll definitely be sorry you chased his money away.

[Danenania]

Hmm, I see your points but I think the decision has to be between raising and folding with so many possible draws and the player behind you. I mean if you feel you have enough equity to call down, isn't it critical to protect that equity by raising? You lose your two outs when facing two pair but besides that it doesn't even cost more.

[StellarWind]

How many outs do you think UTG has and will fold? The OESD and the flush aren't going anywhere. I'll give him a gutshot, an overcard, or small pair for you to *try* to drive out. Maybe 3 outs.

But wait, you are assuming you are ahead. SB must have something and if it's not a king it must be outs. Often you'll get rid of UTG's outs only to discover that SB has those outs shadowed. In particular, you best hope is to drive out an overcard, especially an ace. But you really hope SB has a small pair and isn't the ace apt to be his kicker? Another likely possibility is that they both want the five. Maybe UTG has a cheap gutshot and SB has gutshot plus small pair.

Overall killing UTG is not worth the trouble. It's just too unlikely that you will lose the hand because you didn't raise. Against that you will often lose the hand because you do raise when Villain has kings up and three bets your outs away. Plus you lose the chance to win the money UTG would have called the turn and possibly the river with.