5/10 nl, Top set JJJ - Page 4

captZEEbo1 · #31 10-04-2005, 08:43 AM

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If you check behnind on the turn are you folding to a push on any card?

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not a jack!!!111

but I think it might be more profitable to call a river push than to push turn myself...another issue is if the flush card comes on river, you could easily be faced with a blocking bet instead of an allin. However, I'm not sure if this is still results-oriented thinking or not

Yeti · #32 10-04-2005, 09:06 AM

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What range of hands do u threebet like that?

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captZEEbo1 · #33 10-04-2005, 09:10 AM

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What range of hands do u threebet like that?

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Not much, but my opponent doesn't know that. For all he knows, I have AJ and am throwing out another feeler or have 87 and am trying to take down the pot with looks of strength

edge · #34 10-04-2005, 09:12 AM

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Pushing the flop is really bad.

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If I get all-in on either of those two flops, I'm ahead a lot more often than I'm behind. Any two pair, combo draw, set, and maybe overpair will gamble with me. I'm behind only a flopped straight, and I have good outs.

-Skeme- · #35 10-04-2005, 09:42 AM

I don't think people are saying, "pushing the flop is bad" because they think you're behind, it's because it'll most likely kill your action. It's a pretty big overbet, is it not?

edge · #36 10-04-2005, 12:01 PM

Oh, I don't actually push after the checkraise, but if he openpushed or something I would call. Just saying that I would like to get all-in on a flop like that, disregarding the actual action. Like I said before, I make it about 600 and get the rest in on the turn or I call and push over the top on the turn, depending on the player and what I had for breakfast.

AEKDBet · #37 10-04-2005, 02:10 PM

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Oh, I don't actually push after the checkraise, but if he openpushed or something I would call. Just saying that I would like to get all-in on a flop like that, disregarding the actual action. Like I said before, I make it about 600 and get the rest in on the turn or I call and push over the top on the turn, depending on the player and what I had for breakfast.

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Image and history are pretty importatn here.
I had a very similar situation come up where a push & huge overbet worked because opponent thought I was bullying / button raising continuation betting way to much and he had landed bottom 2 pr.

AEKDBet · #38 10-04-2005, 06:39 PM

MP ($107.50)
CO ($1468.50)
Hero ($1476.08)
SB ($1031.75)
BB ($1207.59)
UTG ($1177.81)

Preflop: Hero is Button with J[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]. SB posts a blind of $5.
UTG calls $10, 2 folds, Hero raises to $40, 2 folds, UTG calls $30.

Flop: ($95) J[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], T[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 9[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (2 players)
UTG checks, Hero bets $92, UTG raises to $184, Hero calls $1344.08 (All-In), UTG calls $953.81 (All-In).

Turn: ($2668.89) Q[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (2 players, 2 all-in)

River: ($2668.89) 3[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (2 players, 2 all-in)

Final Pot: $2668.89

Results in white below: 
UTG has Ts 9s (two pair, tens and nines).
Hero has Jd Js (three of a kind, jacks).
Outcome: Hero wins $2668.89. 

Check out that turn card. THAT would have killed my action.

Chris Daddy Cool · #39 10-04-2005, 06:55 PM

the flop 3-bet is weird because hardly anybody ever does that. what range of hands are you doing it with?

because against good players i'll usually be bluffing and agaisnt bad players i'll usually ahve the nuts when i pull this.

this is why people are telling you to stick it in on the flop (though given the deep stacks you may want to wait as you did). as you played it htough you just have to stick it in on the turn.

captZEEbo1 · #40 10-04-2005, 07:37 PM

[ QUOTE ]
MP ($107.50)
CO ($1468.50)
Hero ($1476.08)
SB ($1031.75)
BB ($1207.59)
UTG ($1177.81)

Preflop: Hero is Button with J[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]. SB posts a blind of $5.
UTG calls $10, 2 folds, Hero raises to $40, 2 folds, UTG calls $30.

Flop: ($95) J[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], T[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 9[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (2 players)
UTG checks, Hero bets $92, UTG raises to $184, Hero calls $1344.08 (All-In), UTG calls $953.81 (All-In).

Turn: ($2668.89) Q[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (2 players, 2 all-in)

River: ($2668.89) 3[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (2 players, 2 all-in)

Final Pot: $2668.89

Results in white below: 
UTG has Ts 9s (two pair, tens and nines).
Hero has Jd Js (three of a kind, jacks).
Outcome: Hero wins $2668.89. 

Check out that turn card. THAT would have killed my action.

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There's a difference...I had about 35 more BB's than your opponent, and also that flop it's a lot more likely someone will call with pair + OESD or flush draw+gut/oesd, whereas my flop, it's very likely he JUST has the draw and not top pair or two pair or something (since 3 of the 4 top pair cards are out).