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  #1  
Old 12-11-2005, 07:58 PM
brick brick is offline
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Default How are you going to deal with tougher games in the future?

How are you going to deal with tougher games in the future?

Be patient and only sit in games that are better than average?
Limit the amount of poker you play?
Move down in stakes?

The poker boom is slowing, the number of new players and gambling types is now dwarfed by the number of players who are trying to play well.

The big difference that I see?
The boom has changed the perception of poker from that of a gambling game into one that requires skill.

This is bad
for anyone who enjoys winning when they play poker. If everyone is trying hard to win it's going to be a much tougher proposition.
Now many new players play micro-limits online instead of testing their luck at 10-20. Or maybe the tried 4-8 a few times and lost, and so now they're learning the game online.

How are you going to deal with it if your winning game is slowly overcome by a lack poor players, the rake, and variance?
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  #2  
Old 12-11-2005, 09:16 PM
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Default Re: How are you going to deal with tougher games in the future?

If the games get bad online, I'd probably be playing live. The way that I look at: online play has been a good vehicle for learning and building a roll as well as the experience as a whole.

If the games get horrible everywhere, I have no problems giving up the game. There's other hobbies I've made profitable in the past. And I doubt that live play won't be profitable since people that want tend to want gamble-it-up more in a live environment and have fun. That's what most people do at casinos. Internet play is a different beast. People scared of playing online for whatever reasons may be the same gamble-it-up types (e.g. computer illiterate, don't trust playing online, etc.).

I think a lot of people have this sunk cost mentality when it comes to this impending "doom switch" concept. It seems like many poker players tend to instantly refuse to give the game up because they spent all the money and time in books, etc., learning the game, they feel obligated to play it. These same winning gamblers talk about EV but refuse to apply to the poker economy as a whole. I suppose it's not that bad if a once +EV player busts out; he'll either get better or stop playing unless he's a glutton for pain.

I think that for reasonable players, perhaps not so much for the weak-tighties, that online play will be profitable for sometime. If playing online is not that profitable, it will at least be a good training tool for live play.
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  #3  
Old 12-11-2005, 09:33 PM
SNOWBALL138 SNOWBALL138 is offline
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Default Re: How are you going to deal with tougher games in the future?

There's a lot of discussion about this in the internet forum (zoo). Maybe not recently, but its definitely there if you do a search.

People who dedicate a lot of time to studying the game and have good discipline should be able to adjust to tougher games. I make most of my income from poker, but I'm not going to drop out of school. I still plan to be a lawyer. The work is more meaningful and more lucrative.
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  #4  
Old 12-11-2005, 10:22 PM
Alex/Mugaaz Alex/Mugaaz is offline
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Default Re: How are you going to deal with tougher games in the future?

The worst case scenario for winning players is that it will be harder to make less money.
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  #5  
Old 12-11-2005, 11:00 PM
AlanBostick AlanBostick is offline
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Default Re: How are you going to deal with tougher games in the future?

I'm going to deal with the tougher games in the future the same way I dealt with tougher games when I was learning to play: develop my edge.

I started playing in 1997, in Northern California. California's poker boom had long since peaked and stabilized. The games weren't the happy hunting ground they had been shortly after the introduction of hold'em in '87, but they weren't the least bit bad.

Rounders brought some soft new money to the game. So did the World Poker Tour, and the explosion of online poker. The games are rather softer than they were when I learned how to play.

This won't last forever; but I was a winner before the boom, and I expect that I'll be a winner after the boom peaks and tails off into a new steady state.

It's also my opinion that the new steady state will offer softer, better games than were available when I started playing. They just won't be as good as they are now, that's all.
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  #6  
Old 12-12-2005, 01:43 AM
mosquito mosquito is offline
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Default Re: How are you going to deal with tougher games in the future?

[ QUOTE ]

The games are rather softer than they were when I learned how to play.

I was a winner before the boom, and I expect that I'll be a winner after the boom peaks and tails off into a new steady state.

It's also my opinion that the new steady state will offer softer, better games than were available when I started playing.

[/ QUOTE ]

My sentiments.
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  #7  
Old 12-12-2005, 11:50 AM
raze raze is offline
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Default Re: How are you going to deal with tougher games in the future?

[ QUOTE ]
How are you going to deal with tougher games in the future?

Be patient and only sit in games that are better than average?
Limit the amount of poker you play?
Move down in stakes?

The poker boom is slowing, the number of new players and gambling types is now dwarfed by the number of players who are trying to play well.

The big difference that I see?
The boom has changed the perception of poker from that of a gambling game into one that requires skill.

This is bad
for anyone who enjoys winning when they play poker. If everyone is trying hard to win it's going to be a much tougher proposition.
Now many new players play micro-limits online instead of testing their luck at 10-20. Or maybe the tried 4-8 a few times and lost, and so now they're learning the game online.

How are you going to deal with it if your winning game is slowly overcome by a lack poor players, the rake, and variance?

[/ QUOTE ]

Do you have any proof of these happenings, or are you just assuming everyone's passing you by ?
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  #8  
Old 12-12-2005, 12:52 PM
rwanger rwanger is offline
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Posts: 49
Default Re: How are you going to deal with tougher games in the future?

I've been telling people that the games are getting harder, and they do seem to. But, when I look at my stats, you wouldn't know it. I seem to be doing as well, if not better than before, despite feeling like the games are harder.

I don't know why this is. I'm definately a better player, but I doubt that my own improvement is outstripping that of my opponents. I've been moving up in limits slowly, and now I have to think more and make more sophisticated moves to come away a winner.

Do you think it's possible that your EV against "decent" opponents could be greater than you EV against "below average" players...especially in NL?

Truly terrible players aside, I feel like I can put decent thinking opponents on hands more reliably, and thus, make better decisions against them. Plus in some cases, they might be MORE willing to make "huge calls" and try to bluff you when you actually have the goods.

And like it was mentioned above, this might mean playing a slightly looser brand of poker...
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  #9  
Old 12-12-2005, 07:40 PM
raze raze is offline
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Default Re: How are you going to deal with tougher games in the future?

[ QUOTE ]

Do you think it's possible that your EV against "decent" opponents could be greater than you EV against "below average" players...especially in NL?


[/ QUOTE ]

I think this is not only possible but probable. The way I see it, you need to adjust your style to account for every single player type. For example, I seem to be doing better against TAG's than LAG's because 1. Im a TAG and thus understand the mindset and 2. I cant seem to bring myself to call down w Ace-high or bottom pair vs. a LAG. Should you make the most money off the worst players? Yes, as long as you know how to approach and exploit each player type.
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  #10  
Old 12-12-2005, 08:29 PM
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Default Re: How are you going to deal with tougher games in the future?

Derb it up and smoke the rag-tag-tags
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