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  #11  
Old 08-27-2005, 10:36 AM
lastchance lastchance is offline
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Default Re: Heads up pocket 66, call the all in, right move?

I think the people who say fold are wrong.

You need to take any edge you can get HU, and if your opponent is sane at all, they're definitely going to shove a lot wider than the Sharpie says.

It's all about what you put him on, and when he's got a range like that, I think you have to call this hand, which should be a favorite, and is also getting odds.
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  #12  
Old 08-27-2005, 11:21 AM
Sykes Sykes is offline
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Default Re: Heads up pocket 66, call the all in, right move?

[ QUOTE ]
I think the people who say fold are wrong.

You need to take any edge you can get HU, and if your opponent is sane at all, they're definitely going to shove a lot wider than the Sharpie says.

It's all about what you put him on, and when he's got a range like that, I think you have to call this hand, which should be a favorite, and is also getting odds.

[/ QUOTE ]

No offense but any reasonable thinking opponet is not pushing with a large wide of hands with 20BB. I would put his range at 88+/AJs+.

There should be no reason the opponet will be pushing with KT+/22+/A8s+.
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  #13  
Old 08-27-2005, 11:38 AM
lastchance lastchance is offline
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Default Re: Heads up pocket 66, call the all in, right move?

Meet Karlson-Sklansky

The numbers on the right are for how profitable pushes are. If you have SB's less than the really long number at the right, pushing is better than folding even if you turned your cards face up against a computer.
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  #14  
Old 08-27-2005, 11:43 AM
Tater10 Tater10 is offline
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Default Re: Heads up pocket 66, call the all in, right move?

I guess i agree with sharpie.

The OP states this as a pure math problem.

66 vs AA-22, AK-AJ, KQ-KJ, QJ.
I get this as 47.4% vs 52.6%. I will assume payouts of $45/$27/$18.

EV folding would be $35.20
EV calling is .474 * 45 + .526 * 27 = $35.53 (i'll assume you lose if you lose this hand...)

Assuming your asumptions are correct (that sounds stupid), you would make 33 cents by calling. Very close. When I find myself playing tough, agressive opponents in these situations, I call. I'd rather spend my time on a new tournament playing donks than try to eek out another 50 cents worth of EV. If it was passive player instead, I fold.

The key is the assumptions which I wouldnt agree with. Would he push AA/KK here? Is he really pushing KJo? I'd belive the OP's range for the villain if the blings were 250/500+. But at 100/200, I cant think of many hands that i'd push - they are either too good or too bad.
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  #15  
Old 08-27-2005, 11:54 AM
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Default Re: Heads up pocket 66, call the all in, right move?

[ QUOTE ]
Meet Karlson-Sklansky

The numbers on the right are for how profitable pushes are. If you have SB's less than the really long number at the right, pushing is better than folding even if you turned your cards face up against a computer.

[/ QUOTE ]

I can't for the life of me figure out how to read that chart. Any help?
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  #16  
Old 08-27-2005, 11:55 AM
Burno Burno is offline
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Default Re: Heads up pocket 66, call the all in, right move?

Nice post tater. But you omitted a AT-A2 from the villain's range, and this was in the range given by the OP. If you include those hands, 66's equity noticeably increases since it dominates ace babies.

I instacall here against an aggressive opponent with the given hand range. My opponent must be ridiculously tight for me to consider folding. 55 I'd have to think but I'd call b/c, well you know. 22-44 I fold unless he's done this 10X in a row.
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  #17  
Old 08-27-2005, 12:07 PM
lastchance lastchance is offline
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Default Re: Heads up pocket 66, call the all in, right move?

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Meet Karlson-Sklansky

The numbers on the right are for how profitable pushes are. If you have SB's less than the really long number at the right, pushing is better than folding even if you turned your cards face up against a computer.

[/ QUOTE ]

I can't for the life of me figure out how to read that chart. Any help?

[/ QUOTE ]
Read and learn.

Yeah, I explained it terribly, but this should help you.

Useful stuff. Not as useful as ICM, but definitely worthwhile.
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  #18  
Old 08-27-2005, 12:11 PM
Tater10 Tater10 is offline
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Default Re: Heads up pocket 66, call the all in, right move?

doh! forgot the AT-A2, not to mention forgetting you would have 500+ chips if you lost.

that would change the #'s to 54% vs 46% in the OP's favor. I'd call then, unless the villian was extremely weak.

My main point was that at 100/200, with 4500 stacks, I dont think the average 'agressive' player is pushing QJo junk to a raise.
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  #19  
Old 08-27-2005, 04:13 PM
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Default Re: Heads up pocket 66, call the all in, right move?

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Meet Karlson-Sklansky

The numbers on the right are for how profitable pushes are. If you have SB's less than the really long number at the right, pushing is better than folding even if you turned your cards face up against a computer.

[/ QUOTE ]

I can't for the life of me figure out how to read that chart. Any help?

[/ QUOTE ]
Read and learn.

Yeah, I explained it terribly, but this should help you.

Useful stuff. Not as useful as ICM, but definitely worthwhile.

[/ QUOTE ]

That link seems to be broken, can you double-check it?
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  #20  
Old 08-27-2005, 10:59 PM
Bill Poker Bill Poker is offline
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Default Re: Heads up pocket 66, call the all in, right move?

what if the blind is 200/400, 250/500 or above?
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