odd line at 10/20 and where it got me

DrSavage · #1 10-03-2005, 08:46 PM

Villain is 27/7/0.8 over 60 or so hands
I don't think he has a king on the flop b/c of preflop limp, looked more like j9-qj to me, so i went for a turn checkraise which missed. After that i'm almost certain he has a jack and decide to check/raise, however I get insta-threebet. Looks like KJ or a set, but i call anyway. Let me have it.

Party Poker 10/20 Hold'em (6 max, 6 handed) converter

Preflop: Hero is SB with 9[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img].
UTG calls, 3 folds, Hero completes, BB checks.

Flop: (3 SB) 2[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (3 players)
Hero bets, BB folds, UTG raises, Hero calls.

Turn: (3.50 BB) 7[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (2 players)
Hero checks, UTG checks.

River: (3.50 BB) 6[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (2 players)
Hero checks, UTG bets, Hero raises, UTG 3-bets, Hero runs timer down to 5 seconds and calls.

Final Pot: 9.50 BB

brazilio · #2 10-03-2005, 09:03 PM

Once he checks through the turn I just bet/call the river. He's awfully passive, I don't even know if a guy like that is going to bet his draws again on the turn. If he is bluffing his draw on the river he's going to fold to the c/r, and you get the added problems of being 3-bet. Maybe even bet/fold because he's so passive.

Jeff W · #3 10-03-2005, 09:06 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Let me have it.

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River check is awful against a passive opponent.

Fold to the river 3-bet. Easy, esp. with the timing tell.

marsvolta619 · #4 10-03-2005, 09:08 PM

I would probably go ahead and bet out the turn or just 3-bet the flop. Either of these options are going to define your hand more than you did. If he fires back on the turn then you're going to know where you're at. Villain could be raising for a free card with a draw like QT or Jxs. No reason to really believe you're beat on the flop

DrSavage · #5 10-03-2005, 09:18 PM

[ QUOTE ]
I would probably go ahead and bet out the turn or just 3-bet the flop. Either of these options are going to define your hand more than you did. If he fires back on the turn then you're going to know where you're at. Villain could be raising for a free card with a draw like QT or Jxs. No reason to really believe you're beat on the flop

[/ QUOTE ]

Analyzing my play i came to conclusion that i don't check/raise turn enough and miss out on some serious value because of that. So here is an example of me trying to check/raise more,seemed like a good idea at the time.

Also, (to others), he didn't seem that passive at the time. Aggression factor is meaningless at 60 hands, my impression at the time was that his aggression was at reasonable level.

marsvolta619 · #6 10-03-2005, 09:29 PM

I see. I just think a better time to c/r a turn would be in a situation you're sure you are ahead. TPMK is a tough spot to try this at. I realize we're all working on our game in different areas at a time but in this hand you need to see where you're at not be sexy

DrSavage · #7 10-04-2005, 01:41 PM

I'm really disappointed in the answers. Noone really seemed to bother trying to read his hand. After he checks the turn I put him on a jack or QT. He 3bets the river, but what can he have that beats me ? 77 , KJ, KQ, AK raise preflop. KT and 66 bet turn. What hand does he put me on ?If I go with my jack or QT read, I think check/raising river is superior to betting. Suggestion that "you should only be check/raising the turn when you're confident you're ahead" is ridiculous.
I mentioned waiting for a long time before calling because I was trying to put him on a reasonable hand here and I couldn't. I called on the end because river threebet just looked like he would is full of it a fairly large percentage of the time and I'm getting 8.5:1.
He has QT and MHIG. I thought it was an interesting hand, but meh. HUSH has been sucky as of late.

wonkadaddy · #8 10-04-2005, 03:21 PM

yah, the river 3 bet definitely looks strange making it an easy call IMO. still i like leading the river cause i think a middle pair gets checked through pretty often and you lose a bet. u can't expect ur opponent to get sassy a high enuf % of the time to justify losing river bets from middle/small pairs IMO.

Trix · #9 10-04-2005, 06:47 PM

I agree, nh.

goofball · #10 10-04-2005, 07:21 PM

God. he's so passive he's checking through almosot all hand you beat nad betting almost all hands you don't. Bet call the river. I would have just 3 bet the flop though. Makes the whole hand play itself.

The river 3bet is too weird to not call, waht hand is he representing there?