A3s in the BB, what's my flop play

KDawgCometh · #1 08-02-2005, 09:59 PM

Party Poker 2/4 Hold'em (10 handed) converter

Preflop: Hero is BB with A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 3[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]. MP1 posts a blind of $2.
UTG calls, UTG+1 calls, 1 fold, MP1 (poster) checks, 1 fold, MP3 calls, CO calls, Button calls, SB completes, Hero checks.

Flop: (8 SB) Q[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], A[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (8 players)
SB bets, .....what's my action

this is literally my first hand at the table. Should I raise to make the field call two cold? Should I have raised PF?

Nick C · #2 08-02-2005, 10:13 PM

Yikes. I think I'd just call.

I'm not at all confident that's best, though.

As for preflop, I like just checking. Possibly you have a small edge over the field, but you are out of position with a hand that's really only so-so, and I also wouldn't really want to invite someone to limp reraise and build a huge pot.

sy_or_bust · #3 08-02-2005, 10:16 PM

I'm folding. You're in poor position with a marginal hand and no reads.

Anyway, this is a pretty good spot to raise preflop.

#4 08-02-2005, 10:23 PM

how often will our hero win this pot vs 8 ppl? this flop clearly connects with many hands... there are so many cards that will fall and beat us. i think this is an example of waiting until the turn to make a decision. call the bet. hopefully u can raise the turn when a club or brick falls. without the backdoor i might even fold. (im sure i will get flamed for this post)

SmileyEH · #5 08-02-2005, 10:24 PM

I'd raise. This hand is easier to play with the initative.

-SmileyEH

KDawgCometh · #6 08-02-2005, 10:26 PM

okay, if I raise, obviously any flush and 2nd or thrid pair hands will call, but if I raise, I can try to fold out any gutshots and any other backdoor hands. Is this smart thinking(i'm just playing devils advocate here, as I do in most of my hand posts [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img])

SmileyEH · #7 08-02-2005, 10:29 PM

Also, the backdoor draw is big here. It's increasing your pot equity by about 6%.

-SmileyEH

sy_or_bust · #8 08-02-2005, 10:37 PM

Does everyone really continue with this hand? Domination is a significant possibility, draws are all over the place, and there aren't any turn cards that make Hero all that excited. The backdoor flush draw is important, but it's just about all Hero has. 2 EP limpers make it somewhat more likely that a better ace is out.

If Hero plays he should raise, hoping to knock out gutshots, worse pairs, and some better aces. But when a couple players coldcall behind and the turn bricks or scares (essentially anything other than a club!), this hand becomes a death trap, no?

The Nutz85 · #9 08-02-2005, 10:53 PM

This is an obvious fold you have no reads in a multi pot with a poor hand you may allready be drawing dead to a made straight witha KT or against a flush draw and a straight draw if the pot was bigger i would just call to see a turn but it seems your behind in the hand and just get out. Also raising this pot would just build it letting the chasers have odds so its a fold/call scenario to me.

TTChamp · #10 08-02-2005, 11:21 PM

I like raise on the flop:

1. The fact that no one raised preflop tells me that if there is another ace out its kicker is also not good. If you raise, a thinking player in early or middle position may fold a hand like A [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]6 [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]. This fold would be huge for us.

2. An aggressive player may re-raise with an ace with a low kicker and therefore make it 3 bets to the rest of the field. This should fold a lot of gut shots and other draws we want to go away (diamonds aren't going anywhere regardless of the action). We aren't in horrible shape against A9 or lower (split pot is likely).

3. I would rather know where I am when we have to bet SB vs. trying to figure it out on the turn.

All that being said I think a strong case can be made for folding as well. I definitely dislike calling (other aces stick around as well as people with hands like Q [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]9 [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]).