I've been Thinking

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I think there are a lot of Muslims who are not fanatical and who are mainly concerned with the simple things of life, like with their families and putting food on the table, etc. Many of them probably don't realize the full extent to which the Koran tells Muslims to fight and subdue the infidels, etc.

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I was always curious as to how much the average Muslim actually knew of their own faith. Thankfully we have our own Koranic expert here to educate us. I never did hear where you learned Arabic and studied the Koran, MMMMMM. Which institute of higher learning was that, anyway?

The hubris of some here at 2+2 knows no bounds.

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Islam, taken literally and fundamentally, is diametrically opposed to our own values of free speech and equality; to governance by human consensus; and to anything that does not fit the mold of Islamic religious thought.

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Ditto Christianity. Pretty irrelevant point, IMO.

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If all laws and customs come directly from God, what need is there for human modifications, or for other ideologies? There really is no middle ground, ideologically speaking, between such a world view and our way of thinking.

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Wow, the West has joined together and formed a consensus about what constitutes our way of thinking. Quite amazing. I must have missed it in my constant trolling here on 2+2, but apparently the West is of one mind now? Truly astounding. Thanks for the update. I'll note this one down, as it would seem to invalidate all of this 'deliberation' and 'debate' that's been going on in the West the past few centuries.

At the least, I'll certainly have to let Dr. Falwell and Pat Robertson know that pluralism now rules the day in the West.

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Moreover, the fanatical or fundamentalist elements have the literal terxt of the Koran on their side. As Ibn Warraq put it, "There may be moderate Muslims, but Islam itself is not moderate".

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There may be moderate Christians, but Christianity itself is not moderate.

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I have suggested that perhaps we might need a 10 or 15 million man army to actually take over the Middle East and re-mold it along the lines of a Germany or Japan. If the crazy Islamists keep attacking Europe and Australia, perhaps those citizens will get fed up with it enough to decide to do it along with us. Between all of NATO and ourselves, if we were to mobilize and prepared enough, we could likely do it and maintain it for long enough to accomplish serious overhaul reform, though the time needed for reform would be decades.

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You libertarians are a funny bunch, let me tell 'ya.

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If France or other European were to suffer an attack or two on the magnitude of 9/11, for instance, you can bet that their general popular opinion would harden significantly against the Islamists. So in one sense, the Islamists might eventually prove to be their own worst enemies. If they keep attacking most everyone, sooner or later most everyone will be against them.

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Yes, as 9/11 has certainly made American public opinion toward fighting abroad quite hardened indeed.

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All in all a very complex and difficult scenario.

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You seem to have quite a grasp of it all, though. It can't be that complex.