*Official* Big Slick Thread - Page 5

Degen · #41 05-20-2005, 12:25 PM

ahhh so on the surface it appears you and jman are advocating different routes...but it is the same

you just prefer to raise 1/2 what he raises on all premiums.

i DEFINATELY (not to hijack the thread) think that it is a GREAT idea to put in massive bets with AA and KK at the 33 level. guess its kinda dumb to be doing something different with AK but i think this may be more of a 100+9/200+15 thing when you play with the same people and they actually pay attention.

Andre

Degen · #42 05-20-2005, 12:26 PM

www.pokerprophecy.com

Andre

Degen · #43 05-20-2005, 12:28 PM

I fold to the flop raise. You have 6 outs and a slim chance that you are good...but you'll have to pay a lot more to find out.

Andre

Edit: And if i'm calling that flop and possibly more...i'm probably raising right there and trying to take the pot down. TPFAP: 'if its worth a call or its 'almost' worth a call, then its worth a raise if you have a good shot at taking the pot down' (paraphrased)

Degen · #44 05-20-2005, 12:32 PM

Nice flop bet.

Poor turn bet, i'd bet much more or none at all.

You gotta call that turn IMO.

Andre

Degen · #45 05-20-2005, 12:34 PM

If you want to isolate a nit. Or if you think you can win the pot right there.

I play it a lot like you, frequently raising it PF but usually flat-callilng raises with it. Bad line?

Andre

AliasMrJones · #46 05-20-2005, 12:41 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Party Poker No-Limit Hold'em Tourney, Big Blind is t15 (10 handed) converter

Hero (t1000)
MP2 (t905)
MP3 (t1210)
CO (t320)
Button (t865)
SB (t985)
BB (t985)
UTG (t1610)
UTG+1 (t1000)
UTG+2 (t1120)

Preflop: Hero is MP1 with K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img].
3 folds, Hero raises to t95, 5 folds, BB calls t80.

Flop: (t200) 8[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 2[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (2 players)
BB checks, Hero bets t150, BB calls t150.

Turn: (t500) J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (2 players)
BB checks, Hero checks.

River: (t500) 4[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (2 players) BB bets t270 , Hero calls.

Final Pot: t500

[/ QUOTE ]

With multiple hands in one thread, this is going to get very confusing, very fast.

I wouldn't raise quite so much pre-flop. Flop bet is fine. I would not recommend overbetting the flop.

I'm in the let's try to keep the pot small so that we can make appropirately sized bets without sucking up so much of our stack and make this bet look like our other (continuation, drawing, etc.) camp. Part of the reason for doing this is so our later non-TPTK bets look like TPTK and vice versa. If we overbet now and then bet 1/2 the pot later when on a draw, people will pick up on that. By making our flop bets similar in size, we disguise what the bets mean. We aren't giving the opponet correct odds to draw, we provide cover for disguising later bets and we keep the pot to a more reasonable size on the turn.

I'd bet the turn.

The Yugoslavian · #47 05-20-2005, 04:16 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Here's a hand that I butchered from start to finish.

[/ QUOTE ]

No way....if you want to see a hand butchered post flop look no further than some of Scuba's hands [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img] (or the ones that I don't post....[img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]).

[ QUOTE ]

I submit it for destruction.

[/ QUOTE ]

I'll do my best.

[ QUOTE ]

My thoughts preflop: didn't want to steal the small pot, and didn't want to play a big pot out of position (didn't get my wish).

[/ QUOTE ]

You want to be able to control a pot with AK....I think it's a good idea to not want to play a big pot with it out of position with what will be several limpers...and raising big here will just win you a v small pot. I typically throw in a small raise here...to sweeten the pot but not let it get too big.

[ QUOTE ]

Second guessing my limp now though. My thoughts on the flop: Pot sized bet, but I had a feeling it was not enough.

[/ QUOTE ]

Ever thought of checking this flop (especially since there aren't many chips in it yet)?

[ QUOTE ]

My thoughts on the turn: why did it have to be the king of clubs?

[/ QUOTE ]

B/c it will let you check and then reraise weaker kings and weaker hands hoping to bluff you.

[ QUOTE ]

My redraw to the ace high flush and chance of filling up meant that I couldn't let it go

[/ QUOTE ]

No, you can't...certainly not after betting it and getting two callers...

[ QUOTE ]

but I was unsure how to play it when I'm almost certainly drawing, first to act among 4 players, so I continued to butcher it.

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm most likely getting all my chips in with this turn card...given ur playing a 33 or lower you will want to take $$ from the wekaer kings (remember, many Kx hands could be out there...especially given the preflop action). So what is the best way to extract chips from hands that you beat here? Well, I'd say checking and letting them bet at you is helpful....rather than betting. Frankly though, your line turned out fairly well....much of the time you're up against a made flush here I guess...but you hae tons of redraws to win *and* there is certainly a chance that a weaker king took a stab at this pot fearing someone would hit a flush on the river.

I don't mind the end result of yoru line given the cards that kept hitting your hand. What is trickier is if a different club falls on the turn....do you bet then? Are there any bets you'll check/call? Or are you abononing the pot as soon as anyone bets?

Yugoslav

Unarmed · #48 05-20-2005, 04:41 PM

I agree with everything Yugo said, except boning the pot. [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

The Yugoslavian · #49 05-20-2005, 04:44 PM

[ QUOTE ]
I agree with everything Yugo said, except boning the pot. [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

[/ QUOTE ]

Hahaha.....I had to like reread my post 2 times to figure out what you were talking about...I was about to come to the conclusion that perhaps you didn't havfe nearly the sense of humor I had once thought....then I noticed, I indeed, advocate boning a pot, [img]/images/graemlins/frown.gif[/img].

Well played.

Yugoslav
Who thinks AK is a fairly tricky hand but very profitable and a great tool to extract chips from the monkeys...