Modern arguments for communism?

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Than *what*, exactly?

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I'm really not sure - whatever you were suggesting I suppose. Off the top of my head, I'm not aware of a society that has existed successfully for any extended period of time with no government to handle, in Lincoln's words (roughly )"that which the people cannot handle themselves" in the last 10,000 years.

[tylerdurden]

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Than *what*, exactly?

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I'm really not sure - whatever you were suggesting I suppose. Off the top of my head, I'm not aware of a society that has existed successfully for any extended period of time with no government to handle, in Lincoln's words (roughly )"that which the people cannot handle themselves" in the last 10,000 years.

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This is a "results-oriented" answer that doesn't have anything to do with efficiency, which is what the question was about.

Ok then my non-results-oriented answer is - I dont know. You stated that government isnt necessary to fill said roles. I suppose you wouldn't have wasted your time posting had you not had something in mind that is more effective and efficient at supplying things like law and order, roads and bridges, a medium of exchange, consumer protection, defense from barbarian hordes, etc. I really can't imagine what or who could perform that function with any greater advantage. So what say you? What is the better alternative? And furthermore, what would serve those societal needs under communism?

[tylerdurden]

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So what say you? What is the better alternative?

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A construction company, a gold mining company, Consumers Union, private defense companies. Etc.

Is the burden of proof really on "the alternatives" to prove that they are more efficient than government? Shouldn't *government* have to prove greater efficiency in order to (attempt to) justify the necessary invasion of freedom? Note that even in cases where government may make a case for efficiency, I reject it in favor of freedom (and I haven't yet seen such a case).

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And furthermore, what would serve those societal needs under communism?

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Isn't this a circular question?

[natedogg]

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This is untrue, just as there are anarcho-capitalists, there are anarcho-communists who do not support the existence of any government what so ever. Communism is not about supremecey at all, you are applying terms that have no meaning under a communist system. When everyone is equal there can be no supremacy.

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Please tell me you're joking. The only say communism can exist is through coercion. You understand that right?

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Furthermore, under a true democracy/republic the government should know best, as it reflects the direct will of the people.

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Oh.
My.
God.

Did you just say that the masses know best? Did you really just say that?

natedogg

I would say YES, the masses KNOW THEIR OWN WILL. Do they not? Is this not the point of democracy? I would rather return to the status of a citizen, than continue on with the status quo - as simply acting as a consumer in a corporate state, with no real way of enacting my and other peoples' wills in gov't policy.

[tylerdurden]

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I would say YES, the masses KNOW THEIR OWN WILL. Do they not? Is this not the point of democracy?

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So if 50.01% of "the masses" think the other 49.99% should be shot in the head, that "will of the masses" should be enacted?

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I would rather return to the status of a citizen, than continue on with the status quo - as simply acting as a consumer in a corporate state, with no real way of enacting my and other peoples' wills in gov't policy.

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The problem here is not that *your* will is *not* being enacted, but that someone else's *is*. You just want to replace someone else telling everyone what to do with *you* telling everyone what to do.

[The once and future king]

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Please tell me you're joking. The only say communism can exist is through coercion. You understand that right?

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Sending someone to prison for theft isnt coercion?