Anyone have links to K+S chart threads?

[kuro]

Does anyone have links to threads on implementing K+S charts into your stt strategy or a search querry string so that I can find them myself.

I've been looking at the chart and now my aggression in sb/bb fights is really really high on the bubble, in the money, and near the bubble. I basically need to get a better understanding of what kind of edge I should pass up/can't afford to pass up depending on my relative stack size, folding equity, and stage of the tourney.

[citanul]

the things you are asking about have nothing to do with the K/S rankings.

citanul

[kuro]

That's what I was afraid of which is why I really need to read more on K+S especially when I read the thread yesterday where q6s is an obvious push from the sb into a short stack.

You're saying folding equity, stage of tourney etc. don't apply because the model assumes that villains play perfectly and only call when they are even or ahead anyway and so it's simply +ev to push with those hands at a given blind level headsup but the decision on wether or not to push should still be made considering ICM and table dynamics.

[The Yugoslavian]

I'm not even sure what your question *is*.

[img]/images/graemlins/confused.gif[/img]

Yugoslav

[citanul]

i'm saying that K/S is not a model. it is the answer to a question that sklansky asked about heads up play. it is a set of numbers corresponding to each unique holdem hand.

someone may have grown out the results of that question into more than 2 handed poker, but i do not believe that it was karlson or sklansky.

that's what i'm saying. i'm saying that amongst other things, K/S basically has nothing to do with anything you're talking about.

what you basically seem to be asking about is ICM, not anything to do with K/S (except that they are both about poker).

citanul

[kuro]

I guess what I'm asking is this. K+S chart will show you that at a given stack size heads up it's +chip ev to push into a villain if they can see your cards and only call with cards that are equal or ahead. However, just because it's +chip ev doesn't mean that it's necesarily + dollar ev. So I'm wondering if there is some way to use the chart to quickly evaluate if I should push my small blind with marginal hands like Q5s. or am I stuck having to do ICM calculations.

[kuro]

Thanks that's what I needed to know.

[citanul]

amongst other things, you have to remember that the chart will tell the short stack to call with a wider range. but then again, any sane person plugging stuff into an ICM will tell the shorty to do the same. using K/S in such situations is a little silly, since well, your cards aren't face up, and even if they were your usual opponent wouldn't know how to properly use that information.

i don't want to sound like an advertizement or anything, but if you want to accurately look at such situations, either get used to doing ICM (not that hard) or spend the money for the sit and go power tools. that is exactly what they do.

citanul

[curtains]

K+S chart actually is basically precisely correct when the play becomes headsup in a sit and go. At least you can usually prove that folding is wrong in some situations.

[citanul]

[ QUOTE ]

K+S chart actually is basically precisely correct when the play becomes headsup in a sit and go. At least you can usually prove that folding is wrong in some situations.

[/ QUOTE ]

well yeah, but that has nothing to do with what the OP was asking about which was like, pre-itm play and the like.

citanul