I hate my life.

[EightStuda]

Looks like vilian isn't the only douchebag in this hand........... Let me know if you wanna set up a heads up freeze out match, you pick the stakes.

-Dimitri

[bholdr]

[ QUOTE ]
Looks like vilian isn't the only douchebag in this hand........... Let me know if you wanna set up a heads up freeze out match, you pick the stakes.

-Dimitri

[/ QUOTE ]

OKAY... who'se gimmick account is this?!? OWN UP!

(if this isn't a gimmick acct, i love HU stud, up to 3/6... PM me.)

[BeerMoney]

Thanks for the replies.



I honestly figured after so much money went in the pot on 3rd, it was suck out time. On fifth I figured a raise would better increase my chances of sucking out, as well as buy me a free card. I think both of these are reasonable ideas for a raise on 5th?

Clearly, the biggest disaster in this hand was the 3rd st. raise. However, I figured since there was a dead A, I wasn't in terrible shape.

No, this post wasn't a joke. [img]/images/graemlins/frown.gif[/img]

[jon_1van]

Almost a decent hand Beer,

This move would be better if::
-the ante was bigger
-the Ace didn't limp (huge here)
-you couldn't get much action without moves like this

Too bad the nuances are very important here.

I would have to imagine that if you are sitting at a table of lstreams,Emerys,Rolands,Saras,Frappes (the whole Party medium stakes crowd) a play like this would be ok if and only if the Ace didn't limp. In a game of good players you need to be capable of moves like this so you can get action on your better hands.

When you can beat the game play super straightforward why not do that. It causes much less heartache.

[RayGarlington]

[ QUOTE ]
I honestly figured after so much money went in the pot on 3rd, it was suck out time. On fifth I figured a raise would better increase my chances of sucking out, as well as buy me a free card. I think both of these are reasonable ideas for a raise on 5th?


[/ QUOTE ]

Seems like a good question to explore. To rephrase, When is it a "good idea" to run some-sort of play when you know you are behind? Some ideas: you could take advantage of a scary board (parlay your folding equity), semi-bluff (build future folding equity), pure bluff, build table image (others?)...

In this case, your board isn't very scary. Raising when you hit the 8s doesn't seem to signal anything here (I don't have much imagination though). I just don't think you have any folding equity, nor have the time to build any. Pure bluffing 2 people twice doesn't seem like a good idea either. I guess you are setting them up for a future hand?

I like the question though. If you apply it to heads-up play, like the $30-$60 hand discussed recently. When/why do you make that play? (a moderately strong flush draw brings in, and is raised by the opponent) I guess there is no algorithm to apply that could tell you "now is a good time to do the -EV thing"

[Roland]

[ QUOTE ]

I recently got some good advice from a person whose poker skills I respect greatly when I complained that someone I consider a very solid player reraised my completion on 3rd with an ace in the door when i clearly had a big pair in the hole Kings or Queens. I folded fifth when my queen fell out and the ace also pairs his door card. He showed aces and jacks on the river...others continued in the hand so that's why I got to see it.


[/ QUOTE ]


I think it was a big +EV decision to re-raise you there on 3rd - not because it was the right play, but because it was the wrong play.
Funny thing is, I was sitting there with JJA knowing I should fold but couldn’t bring myself to do it (you probably noticed that I paused for several seconds, thinking “she completed with a ten up and I have jacks… but there are two higher up cards than tens behind her… damnit…”) Now, every time I find myself in a similar situation, this hand pops up in my mind and I just fold and feel good about it. That’s why it was +EV to play that hand… it taught me a valuable lesson about 3rd street play against solid players.

I do think there are spots where you can try plays like this, but they are few and far between. When you have a good hand (usually at least a premium pair) and there are a solid player with a better pair but also a STF (to use Sara’s term) with most likely total crap in the pot, getting the solid player to fold would be great. The problem is, it doesn’t always work out that well - the solid player might see through your little ploy and call you anyway (like Chef did in the that hand we played). Or the STF might suddenly decide to randomise his play and fold. [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]
Like I said, there are very few spots where plays like this are +EV in the tight
Party structure. In a higher ante game things are probably a lot different.

[vintage_sara]

I thought you and I would share this secretly... [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img] but now the world knows.

Love Ya Anyway Roland.