Was this all-in call a bit psychotic of me?

[ZimbuTheMonkey]

It seemed like the right thing to do at the time. I didn't even think about it, I pushed it in. Bison's hand convertor seems to be down, so sorry about the format:

***** Hand History for Game 1714038053 *****
$50 NL Hold'em - Thursday, March 10, 07:44:46 EDT 2005
Table Table 36618 (6 max) (Real Money)

Seat 4 is the button
Total number of players : 6
Seat 1: efren25 ( $52.45 )
Seat 5: prevezor ( $53.64 )
Seat 6: belabano ( $86.51 )
Seat 8: ZMOTO67 ( $23.74 )
Seat 10: HERO ( $116.97 )
Seat 3: POCKETATL ( $54.2 )

ZMOTO67 posts small blind [$0.25].
HERO posts big blind [$0.5].

** Dealing down cards **
Dealt to HERO [ 4d Ad ]

efren25 folds.
POCKETATL folds.
prevezor calls [$0.5].
belabano folds.
ZMOTO67 calls [$0.25].
HERO checks.

** Dealing Flop ** [ 7d, 8d, Ah ]
ZMOTO67 checks.
HERO bets [$2].
>You have options at Table 36630 (6 max) Table!.
prevezor raises [$4].
ZMOTO67 folds.
HERO raises [$8].
prevezor is all-In [$49.14]
HERO calls [$43.14].

** Dealing Turn ** [ 5h ]
** Dealing River ** [ Qh ]
HERO shows [ 4d, Ad ] a pair of aces.
prevezor shows [ 7c, Ac ] two pairs, aces and sevens.
prevezor wins $105.78 from the main pot with two pairs, aces and sevens.

I've been playing all night, so yeah, I'm a bit tired. In retrospect, I think it was a mistake, I mean, he could have had a set, though the read on him suggested otherwise. I had been playing with him for quite some time, and it seemed odd to me that he would raise a set on the flop, so I disregarded the possibility. What do you guys think?

[sourbeaver]

It's not psychotic, but it's not great either (actually, it's bad).
30-70 against a set, 45-55 against a big ace (no 2-p).
It comes down to your read, but there's hardly a spot where you're ahead here.

[josie_wales]

Looks like you call ~$45 to win ~65 (or 1.5-1)

You are a 2-1 dog and some of your diamonds could fill him up (not in this case, but in other cases you are against a set with betting like this.)

Even if all outs are clean, this is fold.

jw

[37offsuit]

A better line is bet 2, then call the reraise. Reevaluate on 4th.

[ZimbuTheMonkey]

Thanks guys.

[jtr]

Hey, Zimbu.

Yeah, sadly I think it's a bad call, but I admire your spirit. [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]

I think the important thing to remember is that all-ins are not symmetrical. If you'd been the one to push, instead of being the one who called a push, I don't think anyone would have a problem with your move. Because that slice of fold equity, even if it's a tiny slice like a 10-20% chance that the guy will fold, gives you a surprisingly big boost in EV.

Cheers,
--JTR.

[pokernicus]

Villain limped in a couple off the button, so he probably doesn't have complete trash (if he really wants to play a trash hand, he's better off raising to steal the blinds). Your bet into two callers indicates some strength, so his raise probably means he has you beat (i.e., he either has two pair or top pair with a good kicker). Top pair with a good kicker is conceivable (he might have raised pre-flop with a good kicker, but he may limp to get some action rather than driving anyone out of the pot).

At this point, I would put him on Ax or bottom two pair (as he conceivably could have limped with 87). Let's think about Ax. If he has a weak kicker, then a raise on his part would be risky unless the kicker paired. If he has a strong kicker, you're also in trouble.

Given the little I know about the situation, I would probably smooth call his raise, and hope for a diamond on the turn.

Although the strict pot odds don't justify a call to see the turn (little worse than 4:1 to make your flush, and the pot is laying you a little worse than 3.75:1 pot odds [compensating for the rake]), the implied odds are very compelling (if he has two pair and a diamond hits on fourth street, he'll probably pay off a sufficient amount to your nut flush, assuming the board doesn't pair to give him a full house in which you might end up paying him off even more...).

I think there are two things to be observed:

1) Your opponent showed real strength on the flop (his raises looked like they wanted to be called, so some serious alarms would be going off in my head). In retrospect, his bets were probably too small since he was giving you about the right odds to make the call.

2) Your "already made" hand was mediocre: top pair w/ weak kicker. You were hoping to hit the nut flush, and he was letting you see another card for a relatively low price...

In general, I think one of the easiest mistakes to make is overplaying a mediocre hand. Remember, this is a cash game not a tournament (in tournaments, people often end up having to be more aggressive and get their money in with weaker hands because of other pressures, such as the size of the blinds in relation to the size of their stack; in cash games people tend to get their money in with better hands...)

[ZimbuTheMonkey]

Thanks for the advice, pokernicus. I'll keep it in mind. [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]