What is the best path?

[bicyclekick]

I got my best friend (also my roommate)into online poker last november and since then he's won maybe 4000, but his role is about 1500 (well - 2000, but 500 is the innitial startup money I gave him that he'll someday pay back) because he's had to spend some of it. He posts on 2+2 as bizot.

He beat .5/1 very handily and did well enough at 2/4 and loved 1/2 6max so when 3/6 6max came about recently he started playing that and has been beating it for about 3bb/100 over some small sample of like 8k hands. He has like 60k hands total I think.

Because he's already kinda messed up once in his life with school, he couldn't take the risk of playing exclusively this summer when he could make 18 an hour for sure working construction...which he works 50-65 hours per week right now...which doesn't leave much time for poker.

He's got maybe 10k hands this month and htat's about all he can squeeze in with having a social life and a gf too...which demand most of his weekends.

This fall he'll be taking some online courses and work will be winding down to a lot less hours and end somewhere around thanksgiving...which is about when the ski season starts and we are planning on spending quite a bit of time skiing out west...paid for by poker...which we will play from our hotel room in the late afternoon/evenings (obviously we'll make sure to get out and have some fun too).

It looks like now with 3/6 6max if his true winrate is 2bb/100, he would be making about 40 per hour plus rake back...so playing for about 4 hours per night would cover the trips...but wouldn't build a bankroll. This isn't what will happen...but is more or less worst case scenario.

I want to get him to beating 5/10 6max as soon as possible and the longterm goal of 10/20 cause that's where the 'huge' money starts being made. If he could be playing 10/20 by xmas that would be very very sweet. I don't care if I have to give (to be paid back what i gave in the far future even) him money for a bankroll...but especially with my coaching him over his shoulder and hanging out with all of us other good poker players it shouldn't be too hard of a thing. The one hangup at least in my mind is he gets pretty emotional about the game. The swings in 3/6 6max already drive him crazy. Up 250 one minute, down 150 not too much later...then up 400, then up 100. It's crazy swings...and I'm sure some of it has to do with his innexperiance. He just doesn't take it very well. Always slamming the desk and yelling or messaging me 18 times about how some retard called 3 bets with q2o and went runner runner etc. I think it's more the losing part than the money part. He doesn't handle losing well, and he's been running unbelievably horrible with sets this month (I think he's lost more sets than I've flopped haha. He was 0 for 5 again last night with flopped sets...and it's emotionally draining to him.) The thing is, based on how much he complains, you'd think he was on a downswing, but he's really winning at 3bb/100...which he must be winning lots of marginal hands and losing his big sets etc.

I played a session of 5/10 a couple weeks ago with him watching me play as a coaching session and the swings in that game seemed about similar to what he experiances at 3/6 except about double the $. And I'm just not sure he's ready for 1000 dollar swings in one session...as I think he's start tilting at like 500 or maybe a little more...he turns into a huge calling station...calling down like 47-48%.

He wants very much to get better and do things the right way. He has been a very good student of the game and asks lots of questions. Doesn't always quite know the questions to ask, but wants to learn very much. He's definately willing to put full effort into getting better (although he really can't fit many hands in right now because of his job). I'm also willing to do what it takes for him to get better. He is my best friend after all and I also want to have a sweet winter.


I'm curious if anyone has any thoughts/ideas for us as to how to approach this?

[Sponger15SB]

[ QUOTE ]
The one hangup at least in my mind is he gets pretty emotional about the game. The swings in 3/6 6max already drive him crazy. Up 250 one minute, down 150 not too much later...then up 400, then up 100. It's crazy swings...and I'm sure some of it has to do with his innexperiance. He just doesn't take it very well. Always slamming the desk and yelling or messaging me 18 times about how some retard called 3 bets with q2o and went runner runner etc. I think it's more the losing part than the money part. He doesn't handle losing well, and he's been running unbelievably horrible with sets this month (I think he's lost more sets than I've flopped haha. He was 0 for 5 again last night with flopped sets...and it's emotionally draining to him.)

[/ QUOTE ]

Well, for starters.... Tilt blocker 2000

[mantasm]

Sounds like he's doing pretty well. Dealing with tilt comes with more experience, he just needs to make sure he's not playing if he's tilting. I'm sure you've explained the "don't get mad, that's where our money comes from" thing already.

I've been thinking about getting my friend into poker too, he sounds like he's in a situation similar to yours, but with more free time. How'd you get him started out? Did you give him books, sweat his sessions, let him watch you play, etc? Thanks.

[etizzle]

it sounds like you have him on the right path already, but one thing I would suggest would be to have him learn NL hold em a little at a time.

Switching from fixed limit to NL often keeps me sane while playing many hours in a row. And there is no shortage of money to be made at online NL.

Keep his main game limit though. He will be playing 10 20 soon I'm sure.

[Sponger15SB]

[ QUOTE ]
it sounds like you have him on the right path already, but one thing I would suggest would be to have him learn NL hold em a little at a time.

Switching from fixed limit to NL often keeps me sane while playing many hours in a row. And there is no shortage of money to be made at online NL.

[/ QUOTE ]

This sounds like a terrible idea, especially for someone who gets overly stressed out about the losses.

[AustinDoug]

The biggest factor for me in reducing tilt was just playing a LOT of hands. After awhile, you understand the "big picture" and don't worry about improbable losses. (Although, the enjoyment of winning is reduced as well.)

I never check my BR while playing and I will not allow myself to attempt to calculate whether I am up or down and by how much while I am playing.

I diagree with people who hit things and curse and then say "I just had to get it out of my system." For me at least, yelling just makes me madder and makes it more difficult to stop thinking about the bad beat.

[etizzle]

This makes perfect sense, as NL has significantly smaller variance.

[timprov]

Experience should do it, I would think. Is he not Scandosotan? If he is he's pretty lame. We have an ethnic reputation to maintain.

[bicyclekick]

He's not going to be learning no limit. I don't even know how to play no limit. Interesting idea but it's not what he's going to do. Further discussion not needed.

[etizzle]

fine fine