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Old 12-09-2005, 01:01 AM
Matt Flynn Matt Flynn is offline
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Default Should the responsible Merck executives go to jail?

More on the Vioxx scandal. Vioxx is an antiinflammatory drug like Advil, except in many patients it works better. Too bad, because it causes a greater-than-acceptable increased risk of heart attacks.* When Merck published the safety data in and around 2000, the company intentionally withheld and deleted data on three heart attacks to make the drug look safer. They submitted all the data on a diskette, but failed to include it in the landmark paper that made their drug a huge success.

The nation's top medical journal, the New England Journal of Medicine, called them out on it recently:

http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20051209/...oxx_journal_dc

There is no direct article right now. Apparently it was a press release from NEJM.


Merck knew about the heart attacks and failed to put the material in the manuscript. The FDA pulled Vioxx from the market due to an increased risk of heart attacks in 2004. Too bad for some people because for them it really worked. But not so useful if you are dead.

Should the people at Merck be held criminally liable for their actions?



* As for "greater-than-acceptable" risk of death, it is good to be on a forum where people understand probability. The typical knee-jerk response is that no risk of death is tolerable from a medicine. Everyone who says this DRIVES to their doctor's office, often on crowded freeways while using a cell phone. That carries a significant risk of death and yet many a drug with a safety profile better than driving to the doctor's office (like Accutane) get heavily regulated or thrown out. Vioxx is not one of those: the risks of heart attacks remained small, but there were acceptable and available substitues that did not cause the problem. Much of the added risk was unnecessary and not associated with additional gain.


So, again, you are on the jury: the junior exec whose pay and future were tied up in the success of Vioxx knew the data were fudged and submitted the falsified manuscript anyway. Should that junior exec do jail time? How much and what kind? What's red collar crime worth?
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  #2  
Old 12-09-2005, 01:26 AM
OtisTheMarsupial OtisTheMarsupial is offline
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Default Re: Should the responsible Merck executives go to jail?

I think so, yes.
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  #3  
Old 12-09-2005, 01:28 AM
nothumb nothumb is offline
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Default Re: Should the responsible Merck executives go to jail?

I think they should have to take the [censored] stuff themselves, and give it to their families too.

NT
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Old 12-09-2005, 01:29 AM
jba jba is offline
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Default Re: Should the responsible Merck executives go to jail?

this trial you speak of?

it usually consists of more than 200 words and a reuters article.
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  #5  
Old 12-09-2005, 01:32 AM
Blarg Blarg is offline
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Default Re: Should the responsible Merck executives go to jail?

Sure they should. But I'm one of the ones who thought Iacocca should have had his career ended over the Pinto instead of become a public institution.

I don't think the issue comes down to necessarily this drug, but very much the principle of the thing. Risk is a subject that shouldn't be decided based on hidden evidence. This is just fundamentally wrong on principle and very dangerous to let drug companies think they can get away with. The stakes to be considered first should be the ones of life and death, not of profit.

Risks will always be taken. But drug companies have no right to make those decisions for doctors and their patients. Doctors and patients need to be able to rely on the value of FDA's approval before they make the decisions on what risks to take. Some risks may well be acceptable. But if they are missing information, an informed decision is impossible for doctor and patient. The drug company that hides information is basically taking the power of choice from both doctor and patient. And this choice involves life and death.

That sort of playing around is not comparable to the usual corporate crime like embezzling, and should be punished severely. It would be a terrible example to corporate America if they were shown both that there are no significant drawbacks to falsifying data and lying to regulatory agencies, nor to playing fast and loose with American lives.
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Old 12-09-2005, 01:41 AM
InchoateHand InchoateHand is offline
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Default Re: Should the responsible Merck executives go to jail?

Vioxx, as I'm sure you in your medical capacities know, is still the best NSAID ever developed. I'm mad at the executives on many accounts--including the fact that because of their unethical behaviour, people who probably SHOULD take this drug---those suffering from rheumatoid arthritis for example--won't anymore because of the stigma attached to it, and their physicians'entirely legitimate fears regarding liability.
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Old 12-09-2005, 01:42 AM
craig r craig r is offline
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Default Re: Should the responsible Merck executives go to jail?

Will the jury decide on the amount of time the person gets or just whether the person is guilty of that crime?

criag
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Old 12-09-2005, 01:42 AM
lapoker17 lapoker17 is offline
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Default Re: Should the responsible Merck executives go to jail?

Neither side has looked very good in this debacle, but I think fully trusting the NEJM and plaintiffs attorneys at this juncture is perhaps unwise.
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  #9  
Old 12-09-2005, 01:44 AM
InchoateHand InchoateHand is offline
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Default Re: Should the responsible Merck executives go to jail?

Perhaps unwise lapoker, but NEJM has a far tidier reputation than Merck, on many accounts. Sure, innocent until proven guilty, but the two sides should hardly be treated with equal skepticism...
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  #10  
Old 12-09-2005, 01:46 AM
Blarg Blarg is offline
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Default Re: Should the responsible Merck executives go to jail?

[ QUOTE ]
Vioxx, as I'm sure you in your medical capacities know

[/ QUOTE ]

Resist the urge to be dickless more.
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