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  #1  
Old 09-13-2005, 05:27 PM
Guido Guido is offline
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Default Because I\'m a little rusty... Good or bad?

30/60 Party, 10 handed

2 folds and a loose player raises (60/9), the guy to his left 3-bets (33/14 but only after 40 hands, his postflop aggression factors are 2; 5; 4 for what that's worth), the next one cold call (30/15 again 40 hands), SB calls (23/13) and I call with A [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] J [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]. Good or bad?

Flop: A [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 3 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] Q [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]

Checked to the 3-bettor and he bets out, 2 calls and I call, PFR folds. Good or bad?

Turn: K [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]

Same guy bets out again, preflop cold caller folds, SB calls and I call. Good or bad?

River: 6 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]

He bets out again, SB folds, I fold. Good or bad?

Thanks,

Guido
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  #2  
Old 09-13-2005, 05:31 PM
STLantny STLantny is offline
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Default Re: Because I\'m a little rusty... Good or bad?

[ QUOTE ]
30/60 Party, 10 handed

2 folds and a loose player raises (60/9), the guy to his left 3-bets (33/14 but only after 40 hands, his postflop aggression factors are 2; 5; 4 for what that's worth), the next one cold call (30/15 again 40 hands), SB calls (23/13) and I call with A [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] J [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]. Good or bad?

Flop: A [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 3 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] Q [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]

Checked to the 3-bettor and he bets out, 2 calls and I call, PFR folds. Good or bad?

Turn: K [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]

Same guy bets out again, preflop cold caller folds, SB calls and I call. Good or bad?

River: 6 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]

He bets out again, SB folds, I fold. Good or bad?

Thanks,

Guido

[/ QUOTE ]

River fold, imo, is horrible. I think you need to lead or c/r flop.
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  #3  
Old 09-13-2005, 05:42 PM
Guido Guido is offline
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Default Re: Because I\'m a little rusty... Good or bad?

What hands 3-bet preflop, bet the flop and turn (in a multiway pot) do you beat on the river in your opinion? Why is it horrible?

Can you also explain why you think you should lead or c/r the flop?

Just saying what you would do, won't really help me. I want to know why you think some actions are best.

Thanks for your reply,

Guido
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  #4  
Old 09-13-2005, 05:49 PM
STLantny STLantny is offline
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Default Re: Because I\'m a little rusty... Good or bad?

[ QUOTE ]
What hands 3-bet preflop, bet the flop and turn (in a multiway pot) do you beat on the river in your opinion? Why is it horrible?

Can you also explain why you think you should lead or c/r the flop?

Just saying what you would do, won't really help me. I want to know why you think some actions are best.

Thanks for your reply,

Guido

[/ QUOTE ]


Ya, heres the thing, I dont know why. I was actually trying to contemplate it, for the last few minutes, but looking at your hand Im thinking WTF, thats all around horrible, but I dont know why Im thinking that......

Let me get back to you in about 10 minutes, as Im really interested in discussing this because it would be a hand Id have trouble with, but I have to think about it a bit.
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  #5  
Old 09-13-2005, 05:56 PM
STLantny STLantny is offline
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Default Re: Because I\'m a little rusty... Good or bad?

heres my thought process:

I think check raising the flop, may help to define his hand a little better (beacuse even though the sample size is tiny, he seems loose). If he calls the flop c/r, Id lead turn, and fold to a raise. If he 3 bets the flop, I call, and then check/fold the turn (unless you had odds for the 4 outer there, I foget), and then check/fold the river. Id be able to sleep a little more sound my way, but I dunnoooooo.....nh
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  #6  
Old 09-13-2005, 06:03 PM
mc1023 mc1023 is offline
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Default Re: Because I\'m a little rusty... Good or bad?

tough spot.

preflop is def a call.

now on the flop I think you need to really find out where you are at in this hand so that you can get away from this hand.

Two really important factors play in this hand I think

a) preflop 3bettor could be on a isolation raise.
b) preflop 3bettor who leads on the flop is very aggressive postflop even though its 40 hands he is still on the agressive side.

I would checkraise the flop to see where you are at with this hand early, if you get 3betted on that flop from the 3bettor with 2 other callers in its very safe to say your behind and drawing to a runner runner.

on the turn I would check, whether the preflop raiser 3betted or not since K is another scarecard and does not improve your hand.

if 3bettor checks behind on turn I would lead the river, if he had bet the turn I would check/fold river knowing I was behind.

I think with the line you took it's a really tough fold on the river since you are getting 13.5:1 and pfr 3bettor has an aggression factor of 4 on the river which is extremly high meaning he's going to be betting a lot of hands here i.e. Axs.
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  #7  
Old 09-13-2005, 06:05 PM
STLantny STLantny is offline
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Default Re: Because I\'m a little rusty... Good or bad?

Two really important factors play in this hand I think

a) preflop 3bettor could be on a isolation raise.
b) preflop 3bettor who leads on the flop is very aggressive postflop even though its 40 hands he is still on the agressive side.



I totally forgot to write that part down. Iwas thinking that too.
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  #8  
Old 09-13-2005, 06:11 PM
spoohunter spoohunter is offline
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Default Re: Because I\'m a little rusty... Good or bad?

If you are going to lay this down to 1 bet after flopping top pair just fold preflop and be done with this.

Your river fold is silly.
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  #9  
Old 09-13-2005, 06:52 PM
Fillamoore Fillamoore is offline
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Default Re: Because I\'m a little rusty... Good or bad?

This is a tough spot. pf call is mandatory. On the flop, its a tough spot because you have no way of protecting your hand. I like the cr here because:
1) the late position caller and the sb just called which tells me you're ahead of them at the moment
2) Like someone else said, it defines your hand. If you get 3 bet here...just dump it, no big deal. If you he just calls, lead the turn no matter what card comes in my opinion. If you are raised, you can bail. Its one of those situations where you're either way ahead or way behind. If they raise, you're almost guarenteed to be beat. If they call the turn, check call the river hoping to get worse hands to bet for you.

Either way, the fold on the river is definitely not the play you should have chosen per se...lol...i mean, given your line on this hand, checking and calling, what else were you hoping for? You played it like you were on a busted draw. I have to call this river and prey.
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  #10  
Old 09-13-2005, 07:20 PM
Guido Guido is offline
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Default Re: Because I\'m a little rusty... Good or bad?

Again what hands can he play this way that I beat? He seems a little aggressive preflop but much more than TT he probably doesn't 3-bet here. So I only beat TT and JJ but do you think these hands will bet again on both turn and river? I thought I was behind after the turn and I only called to get my straight, when I didn't hit, I folded.

Thanks,

Guido
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