Folding When the Pot is Big?

realbad101 · #1 12-09-2004, 02:04 PM

A couple of times last night I ran into the situation where the pot become large and I knew I was behind but hung around due to pot size. If / when should I have folded in the hands below...

Hand 1
No reads. I hadn't seen anything extraordinary from the players in this hand other than some reasonable agression from CO.

Party Poker 1/2 Hold'em (9 handed) converter

Preflop: Hero is UTG with A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], Q[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img].
Hero raises, UTG+1 folds, MP1 folds, MP2 folds, MP3 calls, CO calls, Button calls, SB calls, BB folds.

Flop: (11 SB) 9[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (5 players)
SB checks, Hero bets, MP3 folds, CO raises, Button calls, SB folds, Hero calls.

Turn: (8.50 BB) Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (3 players)
Hero checks, CO bets, Button calls, Hero calls.

River: (11.50 BB) A[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (3 players)
Hero checks, CO checks, Button bets, Hero calls, CO calls.

Final Pot: 14.50 BB

Hand 2

Read: UTG is a LAG

Party Poker 1/2 Hold'em (9 handed) converter

Preflop: Hero is UTG+1 with A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img].
UTG calls, Hero raises, MP1 folds, MP2 folds, MP3 folds, CO folds, Button folds, SB folds, BB calls, UTG 3-bets, Hero caps, BB folds, UTG calls.

Flop: (10.50 SB) 7[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 9[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (2 players)
UTG checks, Hero bets, UTG raises, Hero calls.

Turn: (7.25 BB) A[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (2 players)
UTG bets, Hero raises, UTG 3-bets, Hero calls.

River: (13.25 BB) 3[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (2 players)
UTG checks, Hero checks.

Final Pot: 13.25 BB

Hand 3

Read UTG+1 is passive.

Party Poker 1/2 Hold'em (10 handed) converter

Preflop: Hero is SB with K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]. MP3 posts a blind of $1.
UTG folds, UTG+1 calls, UTG+2 folds, MP1 calls, MP2 folds, MP3 (poster) checks, CO folds, Button folds, Hero raises, BB calls, UTG+1 calls, MP1 calls, MP3 calls.

Flop: (10 SB) K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 8[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 3[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (5 players)
Hero bets, BB folds, UTG+1 raises, MP1 calls, MP3 folds, Hero calls.

Turn: (8 BB) 4[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (3 players)
Hero checks, UTG+1 bets, MP1 calls, Hero calls.

River: (11 BB) T[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (3 players)
Hero checks, UTG+1 bets, MP1 calls, Hero calls.

Final Pot: 14 BB

Hand 3

wyattjames4 · #2 12-09-2004, 02:42 PM

in hand one i dont see how you could be good. with 4 other players in the hand chances of a 10 being out are high, and with the pot so big no one would fold it. im sure ill get called weak tight for this but id fold the turn probably. i probably wouldve raised the river on the second hand for value. i wouldve been more aggressive on the turn and the river of hand 3. i think a set is the only likely hand someone has that would beat you, as i dont see AK as that likely. it seems a bit passive to just check call the next 2 streets just cause you got raised on the river. he very well couldve raised with a flush draw or just an 8 so you might lead on 4th street or check raise. thats my thoughts but it certainly aint gospel. [img]/images/graemlins/smirk.gif[/img]

Goon2 · #3 12-09-2004, 02:44 PM

I suggest you post the hands one at a time. It's difficult to read the thread when everyone is talking about 3 different hands in one post. Perhaps you could post Hand 1, see what everyone's thoughts are, then toss up Hand 2 and so on.

realbad101 · #4 12-09-2004, 02:50 PM

My turn call in hand one was in the hopes of catching a ten for an inside broadway.

My check call mode in hand 3 was mainly due to my read of passivity from UTG+1.

I normally wouldn't post 3 hands at once but they were all on the same theme.

meep_42 · #5 12-09-2004, 02:58 PM

Hand 1 : This sure roped you in, didn't it?
PF - Fine
Flop - 16:1 closing the action with an overcard and gutshot to the nuts is fine.
Turn - Not the card you wanted. Your outs here are another Q (maybe 1-1.5 outs) and a T (which may split, so we'll call that 2 outs) for 3-3.5 outs. You're getting 10.5:1 on about a 12-1 shot. You can probably expect an extra bet on the river if you make it so this is close. I'd peel one off because there may not be a T out there and .5 outs for an A evens it up.
River: crying call, your 2-pair may be good here 1/13 times.

Hand 2: wtf?
PF - Capping with AQs is excessive.
Flop - Fine.
Turn - I'd call this. Either UTG has a set of jacks or you're way ahead.
River - Bet.

Hand 3:
PF: I complete pf, KQo is just on this side of raising from the SB, I don't make it a habit against large fields.
Flop: 3-bet. You're behind AK K8 K3 KK 33 and 88, AK and KK would have told you they were there earlier. K8 K3 can be ruled in or out by looking at CO's PF looseness. I think you're ahead here until CO caps or raises the turn on you.
Turn: Bet out against a good TAG who would pump a flush draw. If you were capped on the flop I'm probably calling down from here.
River: Fine.

-d

realbad101 · #6 12-09-2004, 03:07 PM

Good advice. My pre-lop cap in hand 2 is due to UTG's lagginess. His VPIP was over 50 and I just read him trying to make a move with his limp-reraise.