I step back for a second...

QTip · #1 11-22-2005, 10:54 PM

UTG+1 seemed to really have a nice game. The second time I dealt with a donk bet like this today from a solid player(AA Withers and Dies). I just sat there for a second trying to make sense of what just happened here...

Party Poker 2/4 Hold'em (9 handed) FTR converter on zerodivide.cx

Preflop: Hero is MP1 with Q[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img].
1 fold, UTG+1 raises, Hero 3-bets, 1 fold, MP3 calls, 4 folds, UTG+1 calls.

Flop: (10.50 SB) 9[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 4[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (3 players)
UTG+1 bets, Hero raises, MP3 calls, UTG+1 calls.

Turn: (8.25 BB) 5[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (3 players)
UTG+1 bets, Hero raises, MP3 folds, UTG+1 3-bets

istewart · #2 11-22-2005, 10:59 PM

Call here, fold UI. He has 99, maybe jacks. I think the turn raise is good though (though looking more marginal since you definitely can't fold to a 3-bet).

QTip · #3 11-22-2005, 11:07 PM

[ QUOTE ]
He has 99, maybe jacks.

[/ QUOTE ]

Is this a standard line with a monster? I posted another hand this afternoon with a donk line from a solid player. To me, the flop line screems, help me protect. Then the turn bet...I don't know what it means. "Help me again" or "You're about to get straight f'd".

Bill C · #4 11-22-2005, 11:08 PM

That 3 bet on the turn is bad news. His stop 'n go and then the reraise suggest he may have made his hand, and he's prolly gonna show you a flush or maybe a set.

You could make your flush on the river and still lose. You could call here and call down the river, but I think you could also make a pretty good case for tossing this one right now.

Just my $.02 worth...

bc

QTip · #5 11-22-2005, 11:12 PM

[ QUOTE ]
That 3 bet on the turn is bad news. His stop 'n go and then the reraise suggest he may have made his hand, and he's prolly gonna show you a flush or maybe a set.

You could make your flush on the river and still lose. You could call here and call down the river, but I think you could also make a pretty good case for tossing this one right now.

Just my $.02 worth...

bc

[/ QUOTE ]

Hey Bill...it's been a while.

I'm normally pretty sharp with hand-reading, but I really got confused here.

This guy certainly wouldn't bet into me with a flush draw, I knew that.

Anyway, this was one where I was willing to pay 2 BB just to see his hand, so I called down.

He played A [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]J [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] like a champion, and I was disappointed that I hadn't thought of it. This was one of the few times that I actually think my opponent was thinking on the 3rd level.

McGahee · #6 11-22-2005, 11:14 PM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
He has 99, maybe jacks.

[/ QUOTE ]

Is this a standard line with a monster? I posted another hand this afternoon with a donk line from a solid player. To me, the flop line screems, help me protect. Then the turn bet...I don't know what it means. "Help me again" or "You're about to get straight f'd".

[/ QUOTE ]

Yeah, against a donk the turn is an insta-raise, but it's tough to see a solid player betting into you again with a draw in this spot. Am I being results oriented in thinking the turn should be a call? You'd like to face MP with 2 cold though, I dunno.

istewart · #7 11-22-2005, 11:18 PM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
He has 99, maybe jacks.

[/ QUOTE ]

Is this a standard line with a monster? I posted another hand this afternoon with a donk line from a solid player. To me, the flop line screems, help me protect. Then the turn bet...I don't know what it means. "Help me again" or "You're about to get straight f'd".

[/ QUOTE ]

From what I've been reading lately this seems to be a good line with big hands that I've been incorporating from time to time. So if "has a good game" means "reads this site" [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img] this is definitely what I take it to be. Of course, could be A [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]T [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], A [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]J [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img].

QTip · #8 11-22-2005, 11:21 PM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
He has 99, maybe jacks.

[/ QUOTE ]

Is this a standard line with a monster? I posted another hand this afternoon with a donk line from a solid player. To me, the flop line screems, help me protect. Then the turn bet...I don't know what it means. "Help me again" or "You're about to get straight f'd".

[/ QUOTE ]

Yeah, against a donk the turn is an insta-raise, but it's tough to see a solid player betting into you again with a draw in this spot. Am I being results oriented in thinking the turn should be a call? You'd like to face MP with 2 cold though, I dunno.

[/ QUOTE ]

Here's another one from this afternoon where villain who donked the turn actually came to say hi and talk about it a bit.

LImitPlayer · #9 11-22-2005, 11:24 PM

To me this just screams flush and I think your 3 bet was spewing a little even with the Q [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]. Getting 3 bet puts you into a tough spot and thats what happened. I just call down here

I Keep notes on players who will raise a donk bet and this is a line I would take on the turn if I made my hand and my notes indicate he raises "donkbets"

On a side note I thought you were getting into the 6 max games, what happened?

Shillx · #10 11-22-2005, 11:25 PM

I don't really like his line here with any of his hands. His play seems reasonable when HU, but you are just missing out on too much value with good hands when the 3rd player coldcalls. Imagine putting 5 coldcallers in the middle and then call-donking with a set or flush (or whatever he has here). That would just be terrible, but I feel like we can even extend it down to a 3-way pot. Metagame goes out the window IMO when he has a full SB sitting out there for the taking.

Brad