Post flop profit maximization. (Flush draw comes through)

bunky9590 · #1 04-25-2005, 12:27 AM

Hey gang, all streets standard until the river who like this play. Anything anyone does different?

Party Poker 5/10 Hold'em (6 max, 6 handed) converter

Preflop: Bunky is SB with 9[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img].
UTG calls, MP raises, CO calls, 1 fold, Bunky calls, BB calls, UTG calls.

Flop: (10 SB) J[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 2[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (5 players)
Bunky checks, BB checks, UTG checks, MP bets, CO raises, Bunky calls, BB folds, UTG calls, MP calls.

Turn: (9 BB) 4[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (4 players)
Bunky bets, UTG calls, MP calls, CO calls.

River: (13 BB) Q[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (4 players)
Bunky checks, UTG checks, MP bets, CO calls, Bunky raises, UTG folds, MP folds, CO calls.

Final Pot: 18 BB

Thoughts , comments?

sthief09 · #2 04-25-2005, 12:33 AM

I would want especially bad players or an especially loose raiser to make the call preflop. I would definitely lead at the flop and call a raise. I like the turn bet. the river c/r is interesting. CO seems like the most likely candidate to have a Q. I'd hate to shut out the field by check-raising him.

bunky9590 · #3 04-25-2005, 12:43 AM

Actually MP was a real Lag, I figured he'd bet the river. If the CO bet, I'd have to just call and go for the overcalls.

twankerr · #4 04-25-2005, 12:48 AM

I lead out the flop. Hard to say how action would have gone if you had lead the flop.

That said...I kinda sorta like the turn bet because of the line you had planned for the river, but I'm not sure you can plan on getting a C/R in on the river. The Q falling may have facilitated a C/R for you. Would you have lead out if a Q hadn't fallen?

Any read on if MP will stop and go? If so, I think the turn is an obvious C/R here. If not, I'm not so sure what to do on the turn. I'd probably C/R out of habit and lead the river. I know its transparent what you have, but I think it would be the most profitable line in the long run (again, assuming that the Q falling is the reason that MP bet the river).

edit: ignore, I didn't see your read in the other post. Well played if you can be that confident that MP will LAG it up and bet this river.

sy_or_bust · #5 04-25-2005, 12:50 AM

Standard? Why wouldn't you lead the flop, hoping to trap BB and UTG? You were lucky that MP/CO pumped the flop and UTG tagged along, but this will not happen very often, and allowing CO's protection raise (or raising yourself) is inferior to betting out when the raise folds UTG and BB, as it often will.

TStoneMBD · #6 04-25-2005, 12:59 AM

dont like the river checkraise. i think alot of players with decent pairs will be scared of someone having trip queens. also, you may very well find that the co has trip queens and will raise you.

bunky9590 · #7 04-25-2005, 01:00 AM

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I lead out the flop. Hard to say how action would have gone if you had lead the flop.

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Everybody likes leading the flop here? Not me, 2 unders and a flush draw, gutshot straight flush draw but gutshot str8 to the idiot end, no thanks, check/call looks quite good there.

[ QUOTE ]
That said...I kinda sorta like the turn bet because of the line you had planned for the river,

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Actually I didn't plan that for the river, I planned on betting the blank river. When the Queen popped up it was a real nice opportunity to get multple bets (and at least one from the LAG)

[ QUOTE ]
I think the turn is an obvious C/R here

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Nah, turn is an obvious bet into that big of a field. I want callers there, let them pay to draw to a heart or something else.

Joe Tall · #8 04-25-2005, 01:09 AM

I would definitely lead at the flop and call a raise

Why would you want MP to shut everyone out on your draw? Define a semibluff for me please, you are fogeting something. That flop texture begs a raise.

Bunk's line is perfect, river flawless.

Peace,
Joe Tall

bunky9590 · #9 04-25-2005, 01:09 AM

[ QUOTE ]
Standard? Why wouldn't you lead the flop, hoping to trap BB and UTG? You were lucky that MP/CO pumped the flop and UTG tagged along, but this will not happen very often, and allowing CO's protection raise (or raising yourself) is inferior to betting out when the raise folds UTG and BB, as it often will.

[/ QUOTE ]

Please tell me you're joking

helpmeout · #10 04-25-2005, 01:11 AM

Bet the flop, look at your position compared to the preflop raiser.

I dont like the FPS on the river, board pairs and you are trying to drive everyone out with a checkraise? Just bet out and hope a Queen raises you so you can call.