150/300 hand

[Paluka]

This is an interesting hand. I guess I don't really like the turn checkraise either. You want to puke if you get 3 bet, and you want to puke if he checks behind.

[imitation]

You just need to 4-bet the flop, I think that turn CR is over-agr for the point of being over-agr...I think you are much better of 3-betting preflop also, It's bad enough having 1 good player with position on you, don't make it 2, also standard comments about being the aggressor to win uncontested postflop.

Don't like it much sir not at all..

[Roman]

you also puke if he raises your bet... so what? I think there should be a better explanation for the best play here.

[Paluka]

I actually don't mind just calling preflop, but I've written about that before.

[flawless_victory]

ya, i just call here too...

dcifr, why do we want BB out?

[Chris Daddy Cool]

i used to always be in the 3-bet or fold camp. but that was when i was a young overaggro kid. raising is fine. but so is calling here. i don't understand why people get so worked up about these kind of things.

[bicyclekick]

Thought about 4 betting the flop and I think it's probably correct. I went into calldown mode though.

My raise was one of those "oh I guess I change my mind I feel like I have the best hand actually and I wanna get more money in there and also even if it's pretty neutral EV i'd rather be playing aggressively like this saying don't mess with me I'm willing to put the preasure on with less that super sweet holdings.

[PokerBob]

[ QUOTE ]
Stox raises on the button. I call in teh SB with JTs, bb is lager and he's pretty solid for those who don't know him. He's kinda the pounding/semi-lag type but not a crazy. He sat down recently so nothing with him has really happened today.

He calls too.

Flop J75r

I check, lager checks, stox bets, I raise, lagger 3 bets, stox folds, I call.

Turn 2

I check, he bets, I raise, he calls.

River 7

I check planning on calling.

[/ QUOTE ]

i don't like/get the turn play at all.

[DeeJ]

i know you asked barron but since I made the same point I will respond [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

exec summary: pot equity
long version : if bb has suited connectors or similar eg 76s 97s 98o he isn't going to want to call 2. if bb has a weak Q/K(?A) like Q8 or K5 he isn't going to want to call 2. But 3 handed if he gets to call getting 5:1 (rather than 7:2) he will likely do so with these hands. If he hits the overcard to your J eg Q-rag-rag or K-rag-rag you are toast, but if you're heads up there is only half the chance that button has hit and you haven't. bb being in the pot also adds to the number of players who act behind, which doesn't help.

The counter argument you may be suggesting is that suited connectors like JTs play better multiway, which is true, but the choice isn't between 1 and 5 opponents, it's between 1 and 2.

[DcifrThs]

[ QUOTE ]
ya, i just call here too...

dcifr, why do we want BB out?

[/ QUOTE ]

DeeJ covered it pretty well but missed 2 points:

1) if the BB was a fish then i dont mind the call from the sb b/c his range is wider and the fish is libel to make some big mistakes. in this case, we want bb out now b/c he's solid.

2) 3betting, while more expensive, vastly increases your ability to take the pot w/ a bet when both miss completely.

Barron