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#1
12-13-2004, 11:50 AM
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How would you have played this?
5 table tournament down to the final 2 tables. Blinds are $50/$100. At my table I'm 3rd or 4th biggest stack (~$3000 in chips). Here's the action: players fold to middle position where a player limps in. Player's stack is $500 shorter then mine. I call with 5s5h. Big blind checks (he has $275 left). Flop is A95 with two diamonds on board. Big blind moves all in with $275. I know this player so I know he paired his ace and has a questionable kicker. He could have hit two pair as well. (Turns out he had AT with no diamonds.)
Now, the other player JUST calls. This worried me. He was clearly on a draw or trying to suck me in. After analyzing everything I determine he had to be on a draw. Thinking I can push him out I move all in and he calls commenting, "Ahhh, what the heck...let's gamble." He has Q9d and is in fact drawing to a flush. Turn is Kd completing his (nut) flush. River doesn't improve me so I'm done. After the tournament it occurred to me that I sensed this guy was on a draw and should have just called. If the turn was NOT a diamond than I could have moved all in and put the pressure on him. I don't believe he would have called my all in with one more card to come. And I'm confident that when the diamond hit on fourth he would have moved all in. So - any advice? Should I have raised pre-flop? Just called knowing he was on a draw? This hand really frustrated me. I was in great position to make some money in this tournament and had I won that hand I would have been in a comanding lead with over $5K in chips. Any advice would be great! (Note, I'm curious how others could have played this hand. I'm concerned I haven't covered every way this hand could have been played. For instance, should I have raised?) 
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#3
12-13-2004, 12:05 PM
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Re: How would you have played this?
The other poster said the odds were in your favor. Any time you can get your chips in with the odds in your favor it would seem to be the right thing. However, since you were in a tournament and putting all your chips in can put you on the rail... the tighter play would be to wait and see if the flush card came on the turn or river.
All that said... you could easily have several opinions as to which is the correct way to play it. Jack
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#5
12-13-2004, 12:28 PM
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Re: How would you have played this?
definitely wait for a safe card on the turn. I've lost many a coinflips by pushing the flop.
It's definitely a different philosophy and it takes a while to swallow. Read up on it, it's worthwhile for sure. PG
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#6
12-13-2004, 12:45 PM
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Re: How would you have played this?
[ QUOTE ]
definitely wait for a safe card on the turn. I've lost many a coinflips by pushing the flop. [/ QUOTE ] THIS IS NOT A COINFLIP. It's not even close to a coinflip. Basics here folks, real basics.
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#7
12-13-2004, 01:04 PM
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Re: How would you have played this?
I think you played it perfect. Almost no chance you are behind at this point, unless he limped in with 9's or A's, both not likely. My calculations say there was 900 in the pot when you pushed all-in, and you should have had about 2700 left. So this means your opponent was getting 3:1 on this call, obviously not a terrible call. However, the fact that he will be crippled if he loses makes this call much worse.
But, we aren't here to critique his play. Now, if you just call on the flop to wait for a safe card, what happens when the turn is a diamond? Chances are you are going to be looking at a big bet, probably for half your stack. You will have to call for 2 reasons 1) the odds say so and 2) there is the chance that he has a hand like Ad6s and is betting on a semi-bluff. Now if the river doesn't help you, he is obviously going all-in after you call the turn. Now you're faced with a huge decision. Call off your remaining stack in hopes that you are ahead, or fold in a huge pot, leaving you as a very short stack anyways. So chances are you are going broke on this hand no matter what. You played it the best way in my opinion. Your opponent made a bad call and got lucky. It happens.
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#8
12-13-2004, 01:07 PM
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Re: How would you have played this?
[ QUOTE ]
definitely wait for a safe card on the turn. I've lost many a coinflips by pushing the flop. It's definitely a different philosophy and it takes a while to swallow. Read up on it, it's worthwhile for sure. PG [/ QUOTE ] By this logic if somoene raises preflop and I somehow know he has kq, and I also somehow know he will call an all in raise. I should call to make sure that no q flops? Odds are similar ak vs kq and set vs pair higher than set with flush draw. The odds are also similar of kq outfloping ace king vs the turn being a diamond.
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#9
12-13-2004, 02:19 PM
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Re: How would you have played this?
[ QUOTE ]
He's significantly better than 2:1. [/ QUOTE ] Actually, no. Result http://twodimes.net/h/?z=659788 pokenum -h qd 9d - 5s 5h - ac ts -- ad 9c 5d Holdem Hi: 903 enumerated boards containing 9c Ad 5d cards win %win lose %lose tie %tie EV Qd 9d 281 31.12 622 68.88 0 0.00 0.311 5s 5h 608 67.33 295 32.67 0 0.00 0.673 Ts Ac 14 1.55 889 98.45 0 0.00 0.016 -d
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#10
12-13-2004, 07:15 PM
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Re: How would you have played this?
If we chose to wait for the turn-
the Kd comes, villian bets 2/3 the pot, your action? if you call, River is a blank, villian bets 2/3 the pot, your action? I assume if he checks the turn and raises you allin, it's an easy fold. -DrG
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