KK - Hand 1

Scuba Chuck · #1 10-27-2005, 10:18 PM

Party Poker 0.50/1 Hold'em (10 handed) FTR converter on zerodivide.cx

Preflop: Hero is MP1 with K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img].
UTG calls, UTG+1 calls, 1 fold, Hero raises, 6 folds, UTG calls, UTG+1 calls.

Flop: (7.50 SB) 5[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (3 players)
UTG checks, UTG+1 checks, Hero bets, UTG folds, UTG+1 calls.

Turn: (4.75 BB) Q[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (2 players)
UTG+1 bets, Hero calls.

River: (6.75 BB) 9[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (2 players)
UTG+1 bets, Hero calls.

Final Pot: 8.75 BB

beaster · #2 10-27-2005, 11:34 PM

To be honest I raise on the turn. Too many times I've seen players bet into a board pair representing trips and they wind up showing two pair, or in some cases, its a stone cold bluff. Your opponent might drop it then and there, to boot. If not, he will likely call and check to you on the river.

#3 10-27-2005, 11:41 PM

I raise the turn. The second Q is a good card for us- -makes it less likely he has one himself. The tougher decision for me would be what to do if he 3bets. It'd be good to have a read for that, but not many micro players will 3 bet that turn without a set/trips of some sort. I think I could fold.

#4 10-27-2005, 11:44 PM

If he doesnt have the Q, why are we raising the turn and not waiting for the river?

If we raise here he folds a worse hand, and its pretty unlikely he could improve that hand to beat us.

We also get an extra card to improve.

#5 10-27-2005, 11:48 PM

[ QUOTE ]
in some cases, its a stone cold bluff. Your opponent might drop it then and there, to boot.

[/ QUOTE ]

if its a stone cold bluff, why do we want him to drop it?

Scuba Chuck · #6 10-28-2005, 02:18 AM

[ QUOTE ]
If he doesnt have the Q, why are we raising the turn and not waiting for the river?

If we raise here he folds a worse hand, and its pretty unlikely he could improve that hand to beat us.

We also get an extra card to improve.

[/ QUOTE ]

Thanks, interesting thoughts.

#7 10-28-2005, 02:33 AM

I like it. If he has a Q (or anything else that beats us) we loose the least and if he doesn't we're allowing him to continue to bluff at the pot.

Weatherhead03 · #8 10-28-2005, 03:07 AM

By raising the turn you can do so many things.

1)You can raise the turn and if he calls then you can checkbehind on the river if you are scared of the Q.
2)You can raise and get 3 bet and fold the river UI (although im still tempted to call the river but I still think you can safely say you are beat)
3)You can raise the turn and bet the river and win an extra BB as you are ahead a fair amount of the time here.

PokerSparky · #9 10-28-2005, 03:12 AM

[ QUOTE ]
2)You can raise and get 3 bet and fold the river UI (although im still tempted to call the river but I still think you can safely say you are beat)

[/ QUOTE ]

Any line that includes folding is not good IMO.

I like calling down after turn donk.

LoaferGee12 · #10 10-28-2005, 03:25 AM

[ QUOTE ]
By raising the turn you can do so many things.

1)You can raise the turn and if he calls then you can checkbehind on the river if you are scared of the Q.
2)You can raise and get 3 bet and fold the river UI (although im still tempted to call the river but I still think you can safely say you are beat)
3)You can raise the turn and bet the river and win an extra BB as you are ahead a fair amount of the time here.

[/ QUOTE ]

I don't see how 2 is a good thing. I also don't understand #1 as I think you should be value-betting this river every time after raising turn.