Whoops! Caught basting a position bettor.

[Trix]

If I were to do this, I would like to have a hand that justifies semibluffing in case he will call. I guess A-high might do if I´m very sure he has little and I´m sure I can give it up unimproved if the guy between coldcalls (Even more so if a club lands on the turn).
You gave it a shot, the guy between you coldcalled, a club came on the turn, I think you can check-fold now, unless he is very loose, but in that case, I wouldn´t raise the flop.
This might change your table image a little, I wouldn´t worry about that. Try and adjust, maybe you will get more action now if anyone was observant.

Someone said the pot was tiny and it is, but against the right opponents, I think its worth it.

[BigEndian]

Think of it this way, I expect to pick up the pot on the flop way more than 30% of the time. If you can learn to identify position bets, this is an easy play.

My bet on the turn was a gaf due to the cold-caller and the flush card. But it's arguably not really a mistake since it only has to work about 20% of the time and the flush card could be just as scary for them as it is for me.

- Jim

[Styles]

[ QUOTE ]
I see how they're similar, but popping a non-aggresive position bettor is a bit different. With a LAG, you are going to cost yourself a lot of checks if you go head to head.

In my hand, it's pretty much a win on the flop or you go away.

- Jim

[/ QUOTE ]

True, I agree. And I think I should have gone away probably. For some 'reason' I called him down [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]

[Styles]

[ QUOTE ]
Think of it this way, I expect to pick up the pot on the flop way more than 30% of the time. If you can learn to identify position bets, this is an easy play.

My bet on the turn was a gaf due to the cold-caller and the flush card. But it's arguably not really a mistake since it only has to work about 20% of the time and the flush card could be just as scary for them as it is for me.

- Jim

[/ QUOTE ]

That's interesting.

Inspite of the "these players never fold" comments around here ... I hardly ever see anyone fold to the raise right there, that's why I said if you think he's not on clubs I like firing again at it. Usually if they fold, they fold on the second round.

Are you saying that a "position better" is maybe 'somewhat aware' and that "position betting" is a coincidental indicator that someone will "let go" to the raise ~30% of the time? Coz my "typical" opponents don't do that, but, they will call and then fold to the next bet.

I think I'm seeing that in your comment but I could be making it up [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]

I try to 'always be a threat to check-raise' so I can pick up free cards, etc. and occasionally I throw in the bluff-check-raise to keep 'em on their toes. How often do you try this?

[BigEndian]

I've found that CRing a position bettor will make them let it go on the flop often enough. CRing represents a huge amount of strength. Sure, there are people who will call down regardless. You don't try this one those players. A typical player who has been CRed before can lay this down.

I only do this is if the situation warrants it.

To be sure, there's plenty of money to be made by letting this pot go and waiting until I have a hand. But I think this is a money-making scenario and letting it go would be the equivalent of letting my top pair top kicker go just because I have 8 callers.

- Jim

[XlgJoe]

[ QUOTE ]
...But I think this is a money-making scenario...

[/ QUOTE ]

You also mention that you win this situation about 30% of the time.

Is this information that you can, or have already obtained from poker tracker? Just wondering because I find it hard to believe that it is a +EV play.

[BigEndian]

I stopped using poker-tracker a while go. But it's my experience that I take this pot down more than 30% of the time on the flop.

- Jim