I hate KK

moot · #1 05-12-2005, 05:45 PM

How the hell do I play this?

Party Poker 0.5/1 Hold'em (9 handed) converter

Preflop: Hero is CO with K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img].
UTG calls, UTG+1 calls, 1 fold, MP2 calls, 1 fold, Hero raises, 2 folds, BB calls, UTG calls, UTG+1 calls, MP2 calls.

Flop: (10.50 SB) 9[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 4[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (5 players)
BB checks, UTG bets, UTG+1 calls, MP2 calls, Hero raises, BB calls, UTG calls, UTG+1 calls, MP2 calls.

Turn: (10.25 BB) 8[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (5 players)
BB checks, UTG bets, UTG+1 calls, MP2 folds, Hero folds, BB calls.

River: (13.25 BB) A[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (3 players)
BB checks, UTG checks, UTG+1 checks.

Final Pot: 13.25 BB

Results in white below: 
BB has 3h 6h (one pair, aces).
UTG has Jh Th (one pair, aces).
UTG+1 has 7h Qh (one pair, aces).
Outcome: UTG+1 wins 13.25 BB.

WarLordAG · #2 05-12-2005, 05:50 PM

It depends on if you've had any reads, but if I had just sat down at this table, I would have folded it too, and probably not raised the flop.

Far too often if an A drops in low limit, you're done. They play any A, any kicker, to any raise.

toss · #3 05-12-2005, 05:50 PM

Without reads I'd fold it just like you did.

tiltaholic · #4 05-12-2005, 05:51 PM

you need reads.
w/o a read sometimes i call down, sometimes i fold.
i lean towards folding as you did.

droolie · #5 05-12-2005, 05:51 PM

Don't beat yourself up. The times you lose a pot like this to three guys with flush draws will be very slim. You played it well. You will be shown a weak A or two pair 98% of the time by one of these clowns.

LoaferGee12 · #6 05-12-2005, 05:51 PM

I fold the flop. An early position bettor in to a preflop raiser to with 2 people calling in between. The more I think about it, the easier the fold becomes.

PS: the title of this makes me cringe [img]/images/graemlins/frown.gif[/img]

tiltaholic · #7 05-12-2005, 05:52 PM

[ QUOTE ]
It depends on if you've had any reads, but if I had just sat down at this table, I would have folded it too, and probably not raised the flop.

Far too often if an A drops in low limit, you're done. They play any A, any kicker, to any raise.

[/ QUOTE ]

often this is incorrect. as shown here.

Spaderess · #8 05-12-2005, 05:53 PM

Since you didn't get 3-bet on the flop I'd call the turn and bet the river if checked to.

./Spaderess

toss · #9 05-12-2005, 05:58 PM

But theres a really good chance were done when 5 players ee the turn for two bets.

chris_a · #10 05-12-2005, 06:03 PM

I personally wouldn't raise the flop after a bet and two callers here. You are "overraising" (I don't know if this term exists, but I'm using it to mean raising calls).

You don't have to assume that the bettor has an Ace. You also don't have to assume that the callers have an Ace. That being said, any one of them *could* have an Ace and your goal, after the point when they call, should be to see a showdown cheaply, or get out and let them fight it out. Raising accomplishes neither and the way you played it, the raise just wound up costing you more money since you didn't even see the showdown. This was the worst case situation.

Therefore, I don't think the flop raise accomplishes much. I think if you were to act after the person who lead out on the flop, then raising would be much more viable. People will probably fold without an Ace or a draw after this point, but they sure aren't going to fold after your raise when they've already called.

Calling the turn and folding the river is completely pointless. Think about it this way: what are you calling the turn for? Your 2 K outs? You shouldn't be. You should be calling primarily because you have a chance of having the best hand. The two K outs help but not that much.

What follows from this is that if you had the best hand on the turn and the Ace came on the river, you still have the best hand after the hand and you should call the river bet.

The way you played it, you gave way too much money away to have not seen a showdown.