14 more marines dead ...

So 14 more marines were killed today in Iraq, courtesy of another bomb in the road. And the general public doesn't seem to care.

Say what you want about whether the Iraq war was a good idea or a bad idea, it's hard to dispute that this administration was not properly prepared for this war. They were not prepared for the wholesale looting. They have been surprised by the insurgency. VP Cheney said several weeks ago that the insurgency was on its last legs. Apparently nobody told the insurgents.

And that -- the fact that our sons, our brothers, our neighbors, have been sent into harm's way without an accurate and adequate plan (and apparently adequate equipment) -- is the true shame of this administration.

[BCPVP]

And the winner of the 'nothing-new-to-contribute' award goes to...niss.

Seriously though, in what way should the U.S. react to such news? Turn tail and run? Hoist the white flag?

Perhaps, in memory of the spirit of these heroes, you could refrain from politicizing their deaths...

[ QUOTE ]
And the winner of the 'nothing-new-to-contribute' award goes to...niss.

Seriously though, in what way should the U.S. react to such news? Turn tail and run? Hoist the white flag?

Perhaps, in memory of the spirit of these heroes, you could refrain from politicizing their deaths...

[/ QUOTE ]

Cut the crap. If you have nothing to contribute, then keep quiet.

[BCPVP]

I believe I posed an honest question along with a polite suggestion that you not politicize the deaths of these marines.

[ QUOTE ]
I believe I posed an honest question along with a polite suggestion that you not politicize the deaths of these marines.

[/ QUOTE ]

And I responded appropriately to your insulting suggestion that nobody should ever talk about the deaths of our soldiers and the war in which they died in the same breath because doing so is "politicizing" their deaths. Ridiculous.

[FishHooks]

We didn't win a battle in WW2 for over two years.....

[villainy]

What kind of American are you BCPVP? This country has always stood for free speech. Nothing could be more appropriate than for people to discuss the plight of this war and the lunatics that took us there. We shouldn't talk about the deaths? It might be politically inconvenient?? Tell that to the families of the dead soldiers. I'm sure a lot of them wish that there and been a lot more discussion about this war a few years ago.

[BCPVP]

[ QUOTE ]
And I responded appropriately to your insulting suggestion that nobody should ever talk about the deaths of our soldiers and the war in which they died in the same breath because doing so is "politicizing" their deaths. Ridiculous.

[/ QUOTE ]
You misunderstood. We should talk about their deaths. We should remember their sacrifice. But please, for their sake, don't turn this into a "we need to leave Iraq now" thread. That's where I fear this is going with your opening post. You started with "14 marines died" and ended with "shame on the admin". You're using their deaths to take a shot at Bush. If you had an ounce of decencey, you'd stop now.

[andyfox]

So the administration didn't prepare properly for the aftermath of the invasion and it's the poster who points this out that lacks decency?

All the government working groups concluded that occupying Iraq would be far more difficult than defeating it. Mr. Wolfowitz either didn't notice this evidence or chose to disbelieve it. He said, "It's hard to conceive that it would take more forces to provide stability in post-Saddam Iraq than it would take to conduct the war itself and to secure the surrender of Saddam's security forces and his army. Hard to imagine."

None of the government working groups that had seriously looked into the question had simply "imagined" that occupying Iraq would be more difficult than defeating it. They had presented years' worth of experience suggesting that this would be the central reality of the undertaking.

The National Intelligence Council at the CIA ran a two-day exercise on postwar Iraq. Mr. Rumsfeld's office forbade Pentagon representatives from attending. Disbanding the Iraqi army was a catastrophic error which created an instant enemy class. Every pre-war study had warned against it and everyone viewed it as something that would be disastrous, except the decision-makers.

Virtually everyone who had thought about the issue had warned about the risk of looting. U.S. soldiers could have prevented it--and would have, if so instructed. So the looting spread, destroying the infrastructure that had survived the war (when the U.S. entered Baghdad, the city was largely undamaged by a carefully executed military campaign) and creating the expectation of future chaos. Rumsfeld opined "stuff happens."

The debacle that ensued was not because the government did no planning but rather because a vast amount of expert planning was willfully ignored by the people in charge. Almost everything bad that has happened in Iraq since the fall of Saddam was the subject of extensive pre-war discussion and analysis. The administration that chose to ignore these analyses has the blood of our boys on its hands. Your indignation at the original poster is misplaced.

[andyfox]

We won this war right away. It's the occupation that's been a disaster. See my post in response to BCVP.