Peyton after two quarters...

[bugstud]

[ QUOTE ]
Did you watch the Giants-Ravens Super Bowl? Did you see Collins' Nancy-girl slide 2 yards short of a key first down because he saw Ray Lewis 7 yards in front of him?

Not only is he an intimidating hitter, he's never out of position (unlike the most over-rated player in the game, Junior Seau), *and* he's the best the best pass-defender of any linebacker who's ever played.

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm going to call BS on the last statement, there are a lot of WLB's that are better in pass coverage, if you want to say he intimidates guys over the middle then say that. Frankly, I'm not on the Ray Lewis is god bandwagon, I think he's getting too much credit in comparison to the past LB's.

[ArchAngel71857]

He's the best defensive player in the history of the NFL, and he's in his prime.

What about Lawrence Taylor?

-AA

P.S. the answer to the inevitable question Taylor vs. Lewis would be like Chris Farley's answer to Bears vs. Bulls during the SNL superfan skit.

P.P.S. Manning is not the best player in the league. 1) Super Bowls = 0. 2) 4th Quarter comebacks? Big games? playoffs? 3) if you want to play the fantasy angle, I know of at least one QB that should be taken higher than him = Culpepper. And if McNabb stays on the pace he is, then McNabb. 4) Co-MVP. PEYTON MANNING IS SO GREAT BECAUSE HE WON THE MVP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! which he shared with Steve McNair. So by that argument, you would have to say that McNair and Manning are the best players in the leauge. As much as I love McNair, that just isn't true. Manning is very, very, good, but he is not the best player in the NFL.

[JTrout]

Tom Brady should get down on his knees and thank God for the "tuck rule" every day.

[Clarkmeister]

[ QUOTE ]
He's the best defensive player in the history of the NFL, and he's in his prime.

What about Lawrence Taylor?



[/ QUOTE ]

Close, but I put him 2nd. I wouldn't get in a tizzy with anyone who put LT first, though I would disagree slightly.

[Clarkmeister]

[ QUOTE ]
Tell ya what, Clark and Kurn. I like Brady ALOT, but since you seem to be heading up the Brady for Prez fan club round these parts

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm haven't mentioned Brady once. I have said that Ray Lewis is the best player in the NFL (and I agree with whoever said that Priest Holmes was the second best), and I have said that Manning is an underachiever and neither the best player in the NFL, nor the best QB.

[Clarkmeister]

Manning isn't in the same stratosphere as Elway. Elway carried very mediocre teams with few weapons (the three amigos? LOL) to three Superbowls on his own. And it wasn't Elway who lost those Superbowls, it was the miserable Denver defense. The fact that he made it there 3 tims was simply amazing.

Manning lost in the first round (after the bye) the year they had home field (inexcusable). He was 0-3 in playoff games prior to last year (IIRC he was favored in all of them). He singlehandedly destroyed the Colts last year vs the Pats with his 4 turnovers in a game where his defense gave him every chance to win.

Not counting James' injury year, he's had a top 5RB and top 2WR on his team on a consistent basis, weapons Elway and Marino never had.

I mean, its not like he is getting to the Superbowl and losing, he's losing before even getting that far.

And have I mentioned how many National Championships he cost Tennessee because of his inability to beat Florida (which Tee Martin did the year after he left)? [img]/images/graemlins/smirk.gif[/img]

And Jeff Hostetler and Trent Dilfer had Lawrence Taylor and Ray Lewis. That's kind of the point. LT and Ray Lewis.

[Clarkmeister]

[ QUOTE ]
Tom Brady should get down on his knees and thank God for the "tuck rule" every day.

[/ QUOTE ]

I know Florida fans thank Tennessee for recruiting Peyton Manning every day. [img]/images/graemlins/tongue.gif[/img]

[adios]

Are you saying that the Ravens wouldn't have won their Super Bowl if they had Manning? I sincerely doubt that that's true.

Your argument seems to be that since Peyton hasn't been on a championship team he's overrated. To be honest I'm not a great Peyton Manning fan but I can think of many teams that has had great defenses that if the Colts had as good of a defense as some of those teams, Manning would probably have been on a championship team already. The Colts defense sucks and has sucked. Even the legendary Joe Montanna played on teams that had excellent defenses. Therefore I don't necessarily think that not playing on championship teams doesn't make you the best player.

If the Colts had Ray Lewis would they win a championship? I doubt it. An old cliche but it's a team game and one great, great player can't carry 10 relatively mediocre to poor performers.

[Clarkmeister]

But it wasn't the Indy defenses that cost them the games that they lost. It was Manning. That's the point.

Elway, by comparison, not only lost the big ones because of his defense, he was able to carry his defense into the big one.

[adios]

Ok then the stuff about Hostettler, Dilfer, and Lewis is a non sequiter.