Torstyn Cole ( A joke )

[Taxidriver]

Torstyn post on Rgppoker :



Ok, I had posted this on the 2+2 forum in direct response to
allegations made by this player and supporters of this player accusing
ACR of acting out of line or needing to post "proof" as to why we
would close down an account containing close to $6k after Taxi-driver
(who has been quite an active poster on 2+2 for some time now) went to
the 2+2 forum for support against us and our actions.

This player/players have blatently broke several of our cardrooms very
clear rules in there attempt to fraud both ACR and our players and as
such not only have they had there account closed but also lost any
right to any funds in those account/s.

Whilst at no time did we find direct collusion between the accounts I
have listed below I also make it clear that collusion is only one
method a player or players can fruad an online cardroom or its
players.

Furthermore, had we not caught this now at the very early stages there
is absolutely no doubt that within a very short time frame they would
have been in full operational mode at ACR as they are and have been at
other sites (and this is not a swipe at any other site or there
security, I am just stating the facts as they are known).

What facts?

It is also interesting to note that since this post not only have
other cardrooms taken there own action on this issue, but I have also
been contacted in private by several other rooms who I will leave to
them should they wish to support the stance taken by ACR or remain
silent and just take the required action based on the evidence they
hold.

No legitamate company much less an online cardroom that lives or dies
by its integrity would risk such an action unless it had absolute
proof/evidence behind there actions and I assure you that whilst I can
not reveal some of that evidence due to the fact our internal security
features would be breached by doing so, I have below provided some
clear reasoning and assure you that combined with other evidence the
charges and action against this player is both beyond doubt and the
action justified.

Ok, I had posted this on the 2+2 forum in direct response to
allegations made by this player and supporters of this player accusing
ACR of acting out of line or needing to post "proof" as to why we
would close down an account containing close to $6k after Taxi-driver
(who has been quite an active poster on 2+2 for some time now) went to
the 2+2 forum for support against us and our actions.

This player/players have blatently broke several of our cardrooms very
clear rules in there attempt to fraud both ACR and our players and as
such not only have they had there account closed but also lost any
right to any funds in those account/s.

Whilst at no time did we find direct collusion between the accounts I
have listed below I also make it clear that collusion is only one
method a player or players can fruad an online cardroom or its
players.

Furthermore, had we not caught this now at the very early stages there
is absolutely no doubt that within a very short time frame they would
have been in full operational mode at ACR as they are and have been at
other sites (and this is not a swipe at any other site or there
security, I am just stating the facts as they are known).

It is also interesting to note that since this post not only have
other cardrooms taken there own action on this issue, but I have also
been contacted in private by several other rooms who I will leave to
them should they wish to support the stance taken by ACR or remain
silent and just take the required action based on the evidence they
hold.

No legitamate company much less an online cardroom that lives or dies
by its integrity would risk such an action unless it had absolute
proof/evidence behind there actions and I assure you that whilst I can
not reveal some of that evidence due to the fact our internal security
features would be breached by doing so, I have below provided some
clear reasoning and assure you that combined with other evidence the
charges and action against this player is both beyond doubt and the
action justified.

Below is the exact text as posted on 2+2.

Whilst I would not normally discuss player accounts in a public forum
in this case I am left with little choice after this player has and
continues to accuse ACR of impropriety in a public forum despite both
telephone discussion and private email correspondence outlining very
clearly the reasons behind my actions.

Without even going into many of the other reasons this players account
has been closed, below you will see the user names of all accounts
opened and played by "taxidriver";

monster, No_badbeat, odds, BERGEN, ODDSTIPSET**, -Oddstipset-,
BJARNE123, oddstipset, heisann, taxi-driver, BERGENCITY, Bjorntje and
Butrelli.

I list these names as I know for certainty that he is also presently
playing several of these accounts at a couple of other cardrooms and
in fact as he has pointed out in the below post that he also has a
user name at PartyPoker of "taxiboy" just this evening he was playing
a high limit holdem game there along side a player named "oddstipset"
with that user name being of course one of his many user names opened
up with us.

Just a freak coincidence? not likely as another one of our players was
chatting to "oddstipset" at PartyPoker a couple of days ago and as
"oddstipset" knew this player was from ACR was very quick in pointing
out exactly how he felt about us closing HIS account.

Our cardroom (like all online cardrooms) have very clear rules in
regards to a player only opening/playing 1 account and whilst
collusion is one very important reason for that, there are also many
many other reasons so the fact that he had not yet colluded (and had
he this whole issue would likely have been bought to light a lot
sooner) is irrelevant.

In closing, whilst online cardrooms can and do have some of the most
advanced automated methods of detecting those trying to fraud both
other players and the room itself there will always be those like
"taxidriver" that believe they can "beat" the system yet as you can
see now it can also be a costly exercise in trying to.

Torstyn Cole


General Manager
www.AmericasCardroom.com
1-888-242-5401

HOW STUPID ARE YOU TORSTYN??

[img]/forums/images/icons/mad.gif[/img] [img]/forums/images/icons/mad.gif[/img] [img]/forums/images/icons/mad.gif[/img] [img]/forums/images/icons/mad.gif[/img] [img]/forums/images/icons/mad.gif[/img] [img]/forums/images/icons/mad.gif[/img] [img]/forums/images/icons/mad.gif[/img] [img]/forums/images/icons/mad.gif[/img] [img]/forums/images/icons/mad.gif[/img] [img]/forums/images/icons/mad.gif[/img]

First of all. I think you did something wrong. However, since they can't proof any cheating they should give you the benefit of doubt. Just keeping the money is very wrong. What do they do with the money ??? They probably just keep it. That is very very wrong !!! I thought of playing there but i don't feel safe. They must tell us what you did. If you cheated somehow but they can't proof it , it can't be collusion. If you was able to hack into their site ; well....congratulation. But in that case they don't deserve any action at their tables.

Come forward and tell us why you keep the money. There is enough discussion about cheating already. I don't want to worry all the time about my $$$.

Rainer

not involved in this case !!! and not a player there


rainerarturmeyer@aol.com

You broke the rules!!!!!!!
You admitted to playing at the same table under 2 ID's.

You admitted to opening multiple accounts.

You got caught and now you cry when you have to pay for it!!!!!

You are bad for online poker.
You break the rules which everyone else must follow.
You commited FRAUD deal with it.

They still can't just keep the money, if nobody was cheated.
Breaking the rules does not qualify for this !! If at all: they must give it to the other players.

Rainer

raineraturmeyer@aol.com

What exactly do you mean by "nobody was cheated", Sir? I do believe the other players at the table were not informed that two seats were occupied by the same person, who was using two different logins. If the stated account of this event is factual, then those people were cheated beyond any reasonable doubt.

I am convinced that the double login was done with the intent to deceive the proprietor of the site , and then use an illegally obtained advantage in order to separate the site's customers from their money. Does this look like a con job to you? It does to me.

Six thousand dollars is a cheap price to pay for this type of activity. He got off easy.

[n1stunnor]

I agree.He got off lightly considering most of that $$ was promo bucks.

It does not change that they can't keep the money. They can easily get handhistorys and give the $$ to the second-best hand then. If players were cheated they should get the money !!! Not the pokersite!!

Rainer

rainerarturmeyer@aol.com

[AmericasCardroom]

This has been a tough decision for me to make in regards to releasing further evidence as this is information that would normally be kept in the strictest of confidence however I refuse to continually be attacked for taking a stand against a group of online CHEATS.

Please note the below accounts with all the following details;

monster - Bjorne Borresen, b@borresen.net
No_badbeat - Bjorn Borresen, bjorn23@private.as
odds - Bjarne Borresen, pokersite@hotmail.com
BERGEN - Bjarne Borresen, pengepoker@hotmail.com
ODDSTIPSET** - Bjarne Borresen, pengepoker@hotmail.com
-Oddstipset- - Bjarne Borresen, pengepoker@hotmail.com
BJARNE123 - Bjarne Bac, oddstipset@hotmail.com
oddstipset - Bjarne Borresen, pokersite@hotmail.com
heisann - Blanca Bac, bjarne1981@spray.no
taxi-driver - Pal Eide, pal.eide@broadpark.no
BERGENCITY - Gulars Spillegal, pengepoker@hotmail.com
Butrelli - Jemil Butt, jemil_b@hotmail.com

Now, ALL the above accounts are not only clearly linked through names and email address combinations BUT are also all linked through IP traces. In most of the accounts they are banned very quickly however days later another one is opened and thus there little game continues on and on.

Furthermore, as an example..

October 17th 2002 BOTH "odds" and "taxi-driver" played off IP - 80.202.119.26

October 19th 2002 "odds" plays a session then 30 seconds after "odds" session ends "Butrelli" logs in from the very same IP - 148.122.229.71

On the day that "odds" and "Butrelli" were DUMPING chips to each other there IP's were 81.27.35.143 and 81.27.35.144 yet when questioned about this both initially denied any knowledge of the incident OR knowledge even of each other. However after further interigation it is admited that they are playing side by side in an internet cafe like they always do.

And just one more piece of information, the player "odds" funded his account on the 10th of November through 2 NeTeller deposits yet this was a live chat I had with "odds" on the 17th November..

Torstyn: Hello
Visitor: hi
Visitor: me again
Visitor: odds
Torstyn: yes
Visitor: I live in Norway how fast can i get the money if i take a cash out?
Torstyn: NeTeller is 48 hours
Torstyn: what is your name?
Visitor: i dont have it
Visitor: odds
Torstyn: your first and last name
Visitor: bjarne børresen
Torstyn: what do you mean you dont have neteller?
Visitor: i dont have an account in neteller
Torstyn: you said you did?
Visitor: sorry??? if i take cash out could i get it into my bankaccount??
Torstyn: not direct to your bank account no
Visitor: ok
Torstyn: we can send you western union or check
Visitor: but how long it take with check to norway?
Torstyn: you sent me an email with your neteller account?
Visitor: do you send it with fedex?
Visitor: forget neteller
Torstyn: well we have already sent 1000 to you NeTeller as that is what you asked for
Torstyn: I will have to speak to my cashier girls tommorow about this now then
Visitor: no no no dont do that
Visitor: dont take cash out
Visitor: you must not take cash out

So only 7 days after opening the account with 2 NeTeller payments of fair amounts, this player not only emails me through one of his many associated emails asking to alter his cashout to a different NeTeller account but then comes on to live chat and makes it very clear he does NOT have a NeTeller account?

Like I have said many times these accounts whilst not having committed collusion on ACR, they have very clearly broken many rules in regards to playing at ACR with the very clear INTENT to break even more (collusion for example).

Our cardroom is very clear on our rules and the punishment for breaking them and that is without taking into account all the other compelling evidence that links this group of CHEATS together.

In regards to these players accounts at other rooms and there behavior there, of course I do not have any more access to that information then a player on that site would, however I let you draw your own conclusions from the evidence of accounts with us.

I do also know as fact through both my own observations AND customers who have been in contact with me is that the accounts listed above have indeed been involved in games together at other sites.

I would certainly urge all sites to make there own investigations into this group if they have not done so already and you the players to ask your own questions of sites you play at where you might have seen these names together (especially those that have emailed me privately asking me to contact the sites they play at).

It is also important to note that it was never my intention (nor did I) to scream out to the world "hey look everyone ACR busted open this huge CHEATING scam" I was and am simply responding to the criticisism being labeled at us by those that are either part of the scam and more importantly hoping to make it clear to everyone that the action taken is both justified and will be repeated without hesitation against those that break our rules.

Kind regards,
Torstyn Cole

Torstyn, you are still not replying to the main question. Yes, they broke your rules, but that does not give you the right to confiscate the funds. To justify the confiscation a fraud should have been committed. Was it? Who was the victim and lost money? If there was a collusion you should give money back to the players who were cheated. If not, don't confiscate, just close their accounts.

Wow, that's a lot of evidence. I now think that this is enough reason to not cash them out. Maybe you set up some bad-beat-jackpot with the money or give it to the players in another way. I still think you shouldn't keep it !!!!

Rainer

rainerarturmeyer@aol.com