Hand vs. QTip. How terrible is the turn?

Dagger78 · #1 10-25-2005, 06:37 PM

OK flame away.
MP3 is QTip (I didn't know this at the time) but stats of 17/8/2.3 over 400.
UTG is a random, no real read.

I'm mostly interested in the turn, I still have mixed feelings on it.

Party Poker 2/4 Hold'em (10 handed) FTR converter on zerodivide.cx

Preflop: Hero is Button with J[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]. CO posts a blind of $2.
2 folds, UTG+2 calls, 2 folds, MP3 raises, 1 fold, Hero 3-bets, 2 folds, UTG+2 calls, MP3 caps, Hero calls, UTG+2 calls.

Flop: (14.50 SB) J[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 5[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], Q[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (3 players)
UTG+2 checks, MP3 checks, Hero bets, UTG+2 calls, MP3 calls.

Turn: (8.75 BB) T[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (3 players)
UTG+2 checks, MP3 checks, Hero checks.

River: (8.75 BB) T[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (3 players)
UTG+2 bets, MP3 raises, Hero 3-bets, UTG+2 folds, MP3 calls.

Final Pot: 15.75 BB

QTip · #2 10-25-2005, 06:42 PM

[ QUOTE ]
stats of 17/8/2.3 over 400

[/ QUOTE ]

[img]/images/graemlins/blush.gif[/img]

Yako · #3 10-25-2005, 06:42 PM

Nice dodge of the c/r, but I think you should still bet it in case you are ahead. And if you're behind, the 3 player might end up calling some extra bets anyway, so even if you get c/r it's not so bad.

Nick C · #4 10-25-2005, 06:43 PM

The turn seems all right to me, really.

AK for QTip just seems so likely, here.

QTip · #5 10-25-2005, 06:50 PM

[ QUOTE ]
The turn seems all right to me, really.

AK for QTip just seems so likely, here.

[/ QUOTE ]

I don't think the check is horrible really given the way it played out, but I do think he's missing out not betting here, especially with the donk in the hand. Still have 10 outs even if (when), I do c/r. But, as said, i have AK a pretty large % of the time here.

I think the hands interesting from my perspective as well. I didn't know who hero was here at the time (stats 8/7/1.5....j/k [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img])...knew he was a decent player though, and would have thought a set would have been bet there.

After he 3 bet, I typed:

[censored], good hand and pressed call anyway.

I thought about just betting the turn there, but most players I think bet the majority of their made hands there, so I thought I'd go for the c/r.

I seriously considered folding the river (as eveyone knows, I've made bigger lay downs [img]/images/graemlins/laugh.gif[/img])

newhizzle · #6 10-25-2005, 06:46 PM

while AK is a very likely holding, i still dont like letting the turn get checked through, i bet/call, then go nuts on the river when it pairs

whats your plan if an A or K falls on river?

Borodog · #7 10-25-2005, 06:48 PM

[ QUOTE ]
while AK is a very likely holding, i still dont like letting the turn get checked through, i bet/call, then go nuts on the river when it pairs

[/ QUOTE ]

shant · #8 10-25-2005, 06:53 PM

I don't get why you guys want to bet the turn so much. What is in QTip's capping range that he checks on this flop. It's not QQ and if it's AA or KK, QTip has some splainin to do. I think it's super likely he has AK or got sneaky with QQ. He's trying for the value checkraise to trap the random. I think that's a good turn check and I probably wouldn't have thought it through and just rammed the bet button because I had a set.

Borodog · #9 10-25-2005, 07:04 PM

[ QUOTE ]
I don't get why you guys want to bet the turn so much. What is in QTip's capping range that he checks on this flop. It's not QQ and if it's AA or KK, QTip has some splainin to do. I think it's super likely he has AK or got sneaky with QQ. He's trying for the value checkraise to trap the random. I think that's a good turn check and I probably wouldn't have thought it through and just rammed the bet button because I had a set.

[/ QUOTE ]

I see your point, and I'm fine with the check behind on the turn. But I think my main point is that Hero didn't know it was QTip during the hand. It's not out of the question that the pre-flop capper could be "slowplaying" AA, KK, AQ. Not that I think any of these is a particularly smart play. I'm just not sure I'm ready to fear the nuts enough to let the turn check through when I have a set vs. two players.

QTip · #10 10-25-2005, 07:05 PM

[ QUOTE ]
I don't get why you guys want to bet the turn so much. What is in QTip's capping range that he checks on this flop. It's not QQ and if it's AA or KK, QTip has some splainin to do. I think it's super likely he has AK or got sneaky with QQ. He's trying for the value checkraise to trap the random. I think that's a good turn check and I probably wouldn't have thought it through and just rammed the bet button because I had a set.

[/ QUOTE ]

Really...if he had perfect knowledge of my play, the check there was perfect. AK is the only hand I play that way. I would cap AA-QQ and sometimes JJ there and also sometimes AQs...depending on variables. However, I bet all of those hands on the flop except AK.

Everything in this hand looks good except my river play.