Best Video Game 1988-1994 Round 3

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All of this is BS anyway because Dune 2 got crushed in two straight rounds, and it was extremely influential.

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I'll say again that this can easily be ascribed to the fact that almost nobody played it.

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Anybody who wants to: they updated it and rereleased it as Dune 2000. I suspect you could probably find a copy somewhere.

[Blarg]

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I have no idea how a multiplayer version would work. Multiple human factions competing for the honor of fighting the aliens? Hmmm. Actually. That might have some potential. Different companies vie for the funding of the world governements and gain or lose it by outperforming the others. You lose when you run out of funding, or when the aliens kill you off. Well, the problem is the time elapsing outside of combat is quasi-real time. You'd probably have to discretize the passage of days some how. I'm not sure how you'd deal with multiple teams getting a chance to detect, shoot down, and raid the same UFO. And if you aren't the one who gets to raid it, what do you do while the other guy is? Do you get to raid the UFO at the same time? Take pot shots at the other guy's men?

Really, though, this was a game that was written for 386's running DOS. I wouldn't mind a version that runs on Athlon 64's running WinXP.

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You could have some added levels of complexity when it comes to missions. For example, two different players could investigate a crash site, and possibly end up fighting each other as well as the aliens. You would get scored based on your interactions with other players as well as success in dealing with aliens.

How about having some diplomacy options, ala Masters of Orion, where you could ally with other players or choose to directly attack their bases. If an ally you could share tech research, choose to share resources etc. Of course there would be much more complexity involved in this type of system, but I think it would be fairly easy to expand the alien types, space craft types and so forth. Deeper tech trees and more varieties of aliens would push the inevitable martian battle back a ways, leaving more time for multi player stuff.

Actually, the more I think about it the more I think it would kick ass if it still were single player, as long as there was more to the research and technology aspect of the game. A huge part of the charm playing the game in the first place was doing the research and finding out which tech trees were useful and which were not. Another great part of the game was discovering new and more dangerous aliens (Mutons and Etherals) as the game progressed. Imagine having a ton more aliens to figure out and beat.

Basically the combat engine is perfect the way it is, so you wouldn't have to tweak that at all. Just add to the complexity of the tech trees and the alien models and spice up the graphics a bit and I'd definitely buy this game in a heart-beat.

Swede

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I wouldn't need any of those changes. I thought the game was perfect as it was, and plenty difficult without extending the tech trees or giving us more aliens to figure out. I'd happily buy the game if it were identical but just had today's graphics. Or anyway better than the old graphics. And heck, it's not even a graphics intense game, so even that doesn't have to be super duper at all. Just gimme the see-through smoke, fire, and destructible world.

[Phoenix1010]

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FF6 losing (and by such a large margin) indicates to me that people simply haven't played it. There is no way that people who have played both games to end could even possibly have 20% that say SMB3. I think SMB3 is a top 10 game all time, but the ONLY thing it edges FF6 in is revolutionary stuff.

FF6 had better plot, music, theme, etc. SMB3 was "revolutionary"....then again so was FF6.


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LOL. you are trying to compare plot.. as if the plot means a damn thing in Mario 3 / any platformer game? In that case, RPGs should sweep every match I guess.

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Length or complexity does not a good story or plot make. RPG's would definitely not have the lock on good stories. Just long and complex ones.

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Blarg is correct. I'll indicate this in future threads with a BIC. However, I think that the size of the story's vehicle can help good stories play out to their fullest, and thus be their best. I think it's easier for a great story to come to fruition in an 800 page book than in the confines of a 2 hour movie, and moreso in an 80 hour game.

[Blarg]

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they are all trivially easy.

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Isn't every RPG easy? I haven't played nearly as many as you guys but can't you beat any RPG just by spending a lot of time on it, no matter how much you suck? I mean so can just keep on building stats until your character is just ridiculously strong? Am I missing something?

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Eventually you can acquire lots of knowledge that helps you do things better even if you're an average player, but you can also figure stuff out yourself, which I guess might make you a better than average player. But it comes down to where you're at at the end. And everybody can get there to a certain extent skill-wise.

Not everybody can get there equipment wise, which can mean almost everything, since the kind of stuff you get by being in a good guild puts you light years ahead in terms of hit points, spells, damage you can do, etc.

But that's not the same as skill. There are many top level people in a RPG who are dumb as a rock and many nowhere near that level who are excellent players and can handle situations much harder than other people anywhere near their level.

Since by the time you reach anywhere near the endgame in these games the whole thing becomes about what equipment you have and what social contacts you have more than what skill you have, how good you really are actually becomes a pretty minor matter. You can be startlingly good compared to others, but when you're attacking stuff 60 or 70 or 100 at a time, that edge may easily not matter or even be seen.

[Blarg]

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people clearly dont know what xcom is.

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FYP by quoting so it gets seen again.

[Blarg]

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I don't know how you would do multi-player, but that game or any game with a (very) similar combat system would be great.

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Some people are doing a free remake. Google Project Xenocide. If it ever gets done, it'll be sweet. Anyone who thinks any game is better than X-COM is wrong.

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Damn straight

Thanks for the heads up, too, I'll check it out.

[Blarg]

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That's a good analysis, Swede. I wouldn't mind having a few more toys to play with, perhaps some discovered by humanity, rather than just lasers, and some new ones from aliens. It might be interesting to have more complicated decisions about weapons choices than, "Sweet, now I have the heavy plasma. I'll give all my guys one of those." Even that giant robotic thing that tagged around with the etherials that was supposedly resistant to plasma went down easier with a heavy plasma gun than with a laser rifle, to which it was especially vulurable. A new pair of alien breeds (since they always seem to come in pairs) could also be an interesting challenge. I think a couple tweaks like this would probably be more refreshing than a multiplayer expansion. Any diplomatic functionality, it would seem, would have to overwhelmingly favor allying into one super-team. A four player game would be like starting out with four bases with four times the UFO hunting power, four times the research and manufacturing capability, etc. Stretching out the solo options a bit would be great.

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I always had a place for lasers. Always.

No worry about ammo, which used up etherium supply. If I remember right the laser pistol fired faster or more times per round than anything in the game. A guy with a laser was less dangerous when mind controlled and wouldn't immediately dump all his plasma ammo attacking my guys. A laser could blow out a wall without wasting precious plasma ammo, etc. I remember getting lots of use out of laser long after plasma was available even if I had a huge ammo/etherium supply. (That was what they called it, right? Think so.)

I could see stretching out the tech tree if the game was multiplayer, but thought it was fine for single player, and plenty challenging enough.

[Blarg]

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I dont see how Chrono Trigger isnt the best game ever. I honestly think most people have never played it.

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And I think you've never played X-COM.

[einbert]

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I dont see how Chrono Trigger isnt the best game ever. I honestly think most people have never played it.

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And I think you've never played X-COM.

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I've never played X-COM but your posts and incredible amount of enthusiasm for the game have convinced me to give this project Xenocide thing a try.

By the way, if you like RPGs at all, try and give Chrono Trigger a chance. You can download the emulated version free from various sites. I really think it is one of the richest RPGs of all time, in terms of gameplay, character development, graphics, plot, music. In fact I would say just about every aspect of that game is top-notch. I'd be surprised if you hated it, you seem to have good taste and an eye for gameplay and details. For me, those are easily the two most important traits in determining the quality of any game.

[astroglide]

i've played dune 2

people would have been waaaaay more likely to vote for c&c or warcraft