Poll: Defining "Typical"

[uuDevil]

This question came up in the beginner's forum. There is constant reference to "typical low-limit games" in the forums, but what is typical? Based on the percentage of pots that are being raised before the flop, what do you think?



Comments welcome.

[Webster]

OOPS - RAISED before flop! 4% - I put some 20%

2/4 games you have 3 people at 8% and the rest NEVER!

[Moozh]

Yeah, I think the real statistic of interest is the percentage of people seeing the flop. That's usually between 35% to 65% (and maybe more).

Sometimes you'll see a maniac that PF raises something like 20-25%. That's ONE person per table usually. It would be a very LAG table to be over 15%

[uuDevil]

Hmmm, maybe I wasn't clear.... Maybe some people are entering how often they personally will raise a pot while others are entering percent of players seeing the flop or something else unrelated....

[ QUOTE ]
Yeah, I think the real statistic of interest is the percentage of people seeing the flop. That's usually between 35% to 65% (and maybe more).


[/ QUOTE ]
No doubt this is the first, most important thing we all look for in a game. Playing online, the range of numbers you give seem about right to me. Maybe that should have been the first poll....

But what I'm interested in at the moment is, given that it is a loose game, and we sit down, we're going to want to adjust our hand selection for how aggressive it is. There's a lot of advice in this forum along these lines that refers to "typical play." Fine. Next question: what is a typical amount of aggression? Hence, this poll.

[ QUOTE ]
It would be a very LAG table to be over 15%


[/ QUOTE ]
Wow. Maybe it's just me, and when I sit down everyone instantly recognizes how tight I am and starts raising maniacly. Are you really saying you see less than 15% of pots raised before the flop? That's less than one every 7 hands-- I would love that!

If your experience is more typical than mine, the option ranges for the poll are way off... But heck with that! The far more important question is where do you play? [img]/images/graemlins/laugh.gif[/img]

[mbraudel]

If I'm reading my Pokertracker stats right, I'm seeing under 5% of hands raised after 8000 .5/1 hands on Party.

[uuDevil]

mbraudel,


Although I only have a little experience with PokerTracker, I think you'll find that the percentage it gives in this case is the percentage of all hands dealt that were raised.

If a given player has PFR%= 5%, and has been dealt 100 hands while seeing the flop 30 times, that means he has raised 5 times. Of course, he has raised a higher percentage of hands he saw the flop with (16.7%).

So for a 10 handed table, with 50% of the players seeing the flop, if PokerTracker reports overall PFR%=5%, then on average there were 5 players raising 5% of their hands for an overall average of 25% of pots being raised. (Actually this is a slight over-estimate, since it doesn't account for reraises, but still a more realistic number, I think.) This was the number I wanted.

Due to some confusion, the poll numbers may not be very meaningful. [img]/images/graemlins/frown.gif[/img]

But thanks anyway. [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

[StellarWind]

How's this for a rule of thumb?

A low-limit gain has a "typical" amount of preflop aggression if 75% of all preflop raises show AA-JJ or AK.

[uuDevil]

StellarWind,

[ QUOTE ]
A low-limit gain has a "typical" amount of preflop aggression if 75% of all preflop raises show AA-JJ or AK.

[/ QUOTE ]
That's fine, but does this correspond to your actual experience?

In these terms, I think only about 50% of raises are being made with these hands when I play.

Translating to percent of pots raised pf (10 handed, 40% SF):

75% of raises with these hands -> ~17%
50% of raises with these hands -> ~26%

Thanks for the input.