Is Phil Helmuth even THAT good?

[Beavis68]

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Anyway, Leonidas had been throwing chips around left and right bluffing, but on this particular hand, Phil had pocket queens. I think Toto had JT. Board was low cards I think, and Toto made some huge bet relative to the pot with nothing. Phil thought about it for a while, saying out loud, "why so much Toto?"...in the end, he decided to call, rather than reraising him. If I recall correctly, a king came off on the turn, Toto bet again, and Phil called again.

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I know people LOVE to bash old Phil but I have to correct you here as it is not even close to what happened. On the hand in question Hellmuth had QJ and Toto had A7. The flop was I believe (and this is from memory) Q-7-x. Toto totally jumps the gun and goes all in with middle pair for a ton of chips. Then Hellmuth, who was outchipped looks at him for a long time and says, "why so much Toto...I call" and commits his entire stack with the far superior hand. Toto rivers a 7 and the rest is history.

Everyone loves to get on Hellmuth but I have to say that pretty much every big hand I've seen him lose, and there have been a lot, are ALL pretty bad beats where he played it right.

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Actually, the hand described above was at the Sands, and I believe it was Paul Wolfe, not Toto (I know it wasn't Toto).

[Beavis68]

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I'm reading his article at http://www.philhellmuth.com/hotw.html and I'm starting to seriously question if he could even turn a profit at online tournaments. His play seems incredibly weak like he always assumes his opponent has him beat. Phil also doesn't seem to adjust to the calibre of opponent he is in the pot with.

Also maybe I'm retarded but it seems like he's making fundamental mistakes like smooth calling with Kings in a multi-way raised pot and then folding when rags flop? What the hell is he doing? Or he knows his opponent is bluffing but rather than shut him down he lets him catch an overcard?

The worst is how Phil will say "I put him on pocket Jacks but I folded my Queens anyways, he showed 7's but that's alright, don't want a 7 to come off and break me". What world does he live in? He gets a read that he is a 4-1 favorite to call all-in but he folds for fear he'll be drawn out on? How will he ever win a tournament playing like that?

I'm starting to think Helmuth sucks.

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He doesn't play to win anymore, he plays to not lose.

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That is exactly what I was thinking! I am a big fan, I have been able to play with him on UB, he is always great on there, I love his book, it got me playing NLH better, and got me playing Omaha very quickly. But, if you read those hands, he just didnt want to take any risks, and ended up getting whittled down 'til he had to go in with crap.

some of those hands I just couldnt beleive, the KK is a good example, why even play if you are just going to toss it to any heat on the flop.