JJ faces aggression

#1 12-29-2005, 01:58 AM

45/15 villain. 100nl. edit: post flop agg is about 2.

PokerRoom No-Limit Hold'em, $2 BB (5 handed) internettexasholdem.com

saw flop|saw showdown

SB ($23.00)
BB ($25.65)
UTG ($73.00)
MP ($82.10)
Hero ($197.00)

Preflop: Hero is Button with J[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img].
UTG calls $1, 1 fold, Hero raises to $5, 2 folds, UTG calls $4.

Flop: ($11.50) 8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], T[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 2[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (2 players)
UTG checks, Hero bets $10, UTG raises to $20, Hero calls $10.

Turn: ($51.50) 8[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (2 players)
UTG bets $21, Hero raises to $50

My logic is that I'm not folding to this bet, and that pot commits me, so I may as well put him in just in case he is drawing.

Edit: I expect him to call, ideally with pair+fd but i could be beat.

#2 12-29-2005, 02:15 AM

Dust,

I like the aggression, but I feel it missed placed, here it's too risky.

I think first of all the preflop raise was not big enough I would of gone to $8, but $6 is a minimum, I don't think $5 accomplishes much. I would have bet the pot also, I know you bet almost that but go ahead and throw the other $2 in there to make it $12 and not $10,

When he raised to $20 this is where I would 3 bet him and go to $60 if he reraises me, I most likely have to fold, if he calls and you see the turn is another club, I have to slow down a bit and bet 2/3 the pot, if he raises me I fold, on the river unless an 8 or Jack come I most likely check and only call a small bet. In this hand I'm really trying to take it down before another club can come on the turn or river, after that I proceed with caution, also he could of had an 8 here, it's too risky to raise on the turn, should have been on the flop, I feel

Isura · #3 12-29-2005, 02:24 AM

Flop is push/fold time. Decide if you are ahead or not.

guns4show · #4 12-29-2005, 02:25 AM

[ QUOTE ]
Dust,

I like the aggression, but I feel it missed placed, here it's too risky.

I think first of all the preflop raise was not big enough I would of gone to $8, but $6 is a minimum, I don't think $5 accomplishes much. I would have bet the pot also, I know you bet almost that but go ahead and throw the other $2 in there to make it $12 and not $10,

When he raised to $20 this is where I would 3 bet him and go to $60 if he reraises me, I most likely have to fold, if he calls and you see the turn is another club, I have to slow down a bit and bet 2/3 the pot, if he raises me I fold, on the river unless an 8 or Jack come I most likely check and only call a small bet. In this hand I'm really trying to take it down before another club can come on the turn or river, after that I proceed with caution, also he could of had an 8 here, it's too risky to raise on the turn, should have been on the flop, I feel

[/ QUOTE ]

this makes little sense. look at the stack sizes

tree_stump · #5 12-29-2005, 02:29 AM

I've gotta say push/fold the flop too... Though I can't see what he'd have that's worth folding to other than a rare set. If he's playing T8 or T2 give him his money, you'll stack him later.

His raise basically commits him, but we're betting that he doesn't know that. In that case, you may as well take a stab at getting him all-in before that club comes while you still have a little fold equity.

#6 12-29-2005, 02:33 AM

[ QUOTE ]
Flop is push/fold time. Decide if you are ahead or not.

[/ QUOTE ]
You push 50 into a 30 pot on that flop? I think I'm ahead, so I want to extract, not fold him out... Can you explain your logic please

tree_stump · #7 12-29-2005, 02:36 AM

[ QUOTE ]
You push 50 into a 30 pot on that flop? I think I'm ahead, so I want to extract, not fold him out... Can you explain your logic please

[/ QUOTE ]

My reasoning for the same suggestion is based on your remark about the turn. A scare card comes, and you're pushing because you're committed...

If you're using that logic, you've mentally committed yourself on the flop and you may as well push while you may still have the lead.

#8 12-29-2005, 02:36 AM

[ QUOTE ]
If he's playing T8 or T2 give him his money, you'll stack him later.

[/ QUOTE ]
I don't like this; I'd rather fold to an 8 and stack him later anyway. If I can put him on better than a pair I want to make the fold. Seems obvious but I guess it's worth saying.

Fallen Hero · #9 12-29-2005, 02:37 AM

[ QUOTE ]
Flop is push/fold time. Decide if you are ahead or not.

[/ QUOTE ]

Isura · #10 12-29-2005, 02:37 AM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Flop is push/fold time. Decide if you are ahead or not.

[/ QUOTE ]
You push 50 into a 30 pot on that flop? I think I'm ahead, so I want to extract, not fold him out... Can you explain your logic please

[/ QUOTE ]

Pushing is the best way to extract. And a push is about a pot-sized reraise. If you call, about 1/2 the deck is a scare card for you and you will probably make a mistake on the turn.

edit: How often do people check/minraise the flop for 1/3 of their stack and then fold?

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