50/100 Blind play

[Seether]

Hand Converter isnt working for some reason so gotta type it out. This is on an empire 50/100 table, BB is probably the softest spot on the table, playing fairly lag, 40vpip/20pfr. However, I have not seen him get out of line post flop.

Folds to hero in the SB with [ J [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 7 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] ]
I raise, villain 3 bets, I call.

Flop comes 2 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] , J [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] , K [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]
I check, he bets, I call.

Turn comes 7 [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]
I check, villain bets, I raise, villain 3 bets, I cap.

River comes T [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]
I bet, villain raises, I call.


Thoughts?

[Seether]

Uninteresting? I was mainly curious about the turn play. I felt that I was ahead but I thought it was slim.

[flawless_victory]

[ QUOTE ]
I was mainly curious about the turn play.

[/ QUOTE ]i think the turn play is clearly correct... the question is whether you should be paying off that river raise.

[Seether]

I definantly wasnt happy getting raised on the river, but I think that I have to pay off this river raise. If not for pot odd reasons simply for meta game reasons against this lag.

[elena_elphie]

I'm not sure I raise preflop, because we know he is going to 3-bet because he is a LAG, and we are playing a below average hand out of position for three bets.

[ QUOTE ]
Uninteresting? I was mainly curious about the turn play. I felt that I was ahead but I thought it was slim.

[/ QUOTE ]
About the turn play, you have a monster hand for a blind vs blind situation, and you know if you check your opponent will bet, so a checkraise looks right. On the river when you are raised you have to pay off given the described nature of your opponent, and the pot odds you are receiving. The only part of your hand I dont like is preflop, just fold and play the next hand. Or call if the BB is unlikely to raise behind you, but given the nature of your opponent you should just fold preflop.

[Seether]

Do you guys really think this is a fold preflop? While I know I dont have an equity edge with the hand preflop but with a table average vpip of like 19% shouldnt i try to be involved in as many hands as I can with the worse player at the table?

I feel that against this player I could make up an equity edge with simply better post flop play.

[ QUOTE ]
Do you guys really think this is a fold preflop? While I know I dont have an equity edge with the hand preflop but with a table average vpip of like 19% shouldnt i try to be involved in as many hands as I can with the worse player at the table?

I feel that against this player I could make up an equity edge with simply better post flop play.

[/ QUOTE ]
A hand like J7o will not do well against the type of opponent you described in my opinion. First of all, a hand like J7o is going to miss the flop very badly most of the time. So when you raise and your laggy opponent 3 bets you, you will be forced to fold most of the time post flop since your hand has no showdown value. And if the laggy opponent just calls your preflop raise, then you put yourself in a position of bluffing off your chips postflop, since a laggy opponent will not give up easily. The time to raise a garbage hand like J7o is when you are against a weak tight person or a person who really respects your raises making it more likely they will fold when they miss the flop. If your opponent does not fold easily postflop than you should toss your J7o away since you wont hit enough flops with this hand to make up for all the times it misses. Generally speaking, when you are out of position against a lag, you should be raising hands with showdown value, ace high type hands, pairs and strong king high type hands, and you should be thinking about limping with some of these same type of hands to let your laggy opponent raise and take control, so he can be the one who is bluffing his chips off.

[adios]

You played:

[ QUOTE ]
Folds to hero in the SB with [ J , 7 ]
I raise, villain 3 bets, I call.

[/ QUOTE ]

And commented in a reply

[ QUOTE ]
I definantly wasnt happy getting raised on the river, but I think that I have to pay off this river raise. If not for pot odd reasons simply for meta game reasons against this lag.

[/ QUOTE ]

BB wasn't the only player showing lag traits. FWIW I don't have a problem with playing J7o (it's marginal) in the SB but I think you overplayed pre-flop against a lag. You have zero fold equity and an aggressive player has position on you for the whole hand and will tend to punish you when you get out of line. Yeah if you call you'll get raised often but so what? You'll get 3 bet alot too.