What is the key to becoming a real top player?

Hello all,

I have decided to register here to get some advice. I am an average sort of player, I can win some small tables and can often in the big online tournaments make the prizes - i.e. finishing in the top 80 of 1000 people tournaments. However I cannot seem to do any better than this. I have a good knowledge of the game and have read books and know what I am doing but I just cannot seem to get any better.

It seems like its no fluke therefore when poker players enter 1000 people tournaments who come in the top 5. It does seem to require great skill to do that well.

My question is - for all you players who are really good and can expect to finish in the top prizes - did you ever find yourself where I currently am - i.e. seemingly the best I can do is come about 50th? Or have you just got the natural talent?

And for any top players - what is the key to your success? I mean I know my stuff - I play the hands as the books suggest you should do - but I see so many players playing hands that clearly a book says you shouldn't play. Is the key to your style of play - i.e. a tricky opponent, aggressive style, etc. Any advice would be greatly received, I love the game but I want to become so much better and I am not sure what I ought to do.

If I was to sum up how I play - I play tight, I never bluff, although I often semi bluff if the odds seem favourable. I get scared off by aggressive play - i.e. if I have a K 6 and the flop was K J 4 - I would be looking to raise a small amount depending on position, but if someone raised big I would probably fold.

Please help!!!

Thanks.

Sorry - I forgot to mention I play no limit hold em - tournaments - where the stake to enter is $10 or less.

[Python49]

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but I see so many players playing hands that clearly a book says you shouldn't play. Is the key to your style of play -

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if you are referring to tournies with 1000 players or so... yes you will need to be raising with marginal hands in position when blinds get high.. to put pressure on the blinds and pick up pots after the flop.

I think its fantastic how good you quality players are. When I first started playing poker it seemed such a simple game where you need a lot of luck. But infact its incredibly skillful.

Thanks for the advice on raising with marginal hands, I do have a tendancy to fold these hands because I don't want to lose chips and end up quickly eliminated from the tournament if I lose.

I rarely try and steal blinds, I am not very good at doing this unless its heads up.

Do you need a certain style of play to be really good? I mean do you have to be aggressive in order to be a good player. And if I say aggressive what sort of aggressive?

[ayecappy]

selectively aggressive [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]

[RevAgain]

Never bluffing is a mistake. The fact of the matter is to win these tournaments you do need to get lucky. You cannot expect to get your chips in with the best of it every single time. It's better to get 4,000 chips in at a 55/45 underdog than blind down to 3,000 and get them in as a 55/45 favourite. The people who win these tournaments are often the sort to go out early when they don't do well, trying to build up a big stack.

You need to identify players who are playing like you are at the moment and steal chips off them [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]. Obviously the more chips you have the more pressure you can put people under, which is why some of the best players are willing to take risks early to get to that position, even if it often results in an early exit.

[Masquerade]

I'm on a similar quest. I think the answer is to occasionally make plays that right now you wouldnt dream of making, and would feel highly uncomfortable making, and have no faith in. What those plays are (and different for each player) is harder to discover.

When I played chess I was sometimes asked by weak players what they could do to improve. There are broadly two approaches to opening the game with White so I asked them which they used, and then recommended them switching to the other one. This was merely a test of their willingness to abandon pre-conceived ideas. Incredibly over 90% immediately disagreed with the suggestion and came up with a set of contrived reasons why they couldn't switch. Those players never improved. I don't want to become the poker equivalent.

[Guthrie]

"And for any top players - what is the key to your success?"

Cajones.

You'll never win NL tournaments by playing tight, not bluffing, and not stealing blinds.

[tdarko]

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I have decided to register here to get some advice

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this is a good start. the more you read here the better you will understand the nuances of the game as well as strategy and you will only become a better player.
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I am an average sort of player, I can win some small tables and can often in the big online tournaments make the prizes - i.e. finishing in the top 80 of 1000 people tournaments. However I cannot seem to do any better than this. I have a good knowledge of the game and have read books and know what I am doing but I just cannot seem to get any better.


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this is actually better than most. note that books aren't everything, you need to be able to apply what is read (i am not saying you don't by any means).
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My question is - for all you players who are really good and can expect to finish in the top prizes - did you ever find yourself where I currently am - i.e. seemingly the best I can do is come about 50th? Or have you just got the natural talent?


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this conincides with your last paragraph. you sound passive and one thing the top tourny players are is aggressive and apply pressure very well.

read the MTT forums, you will find your answers there.

[JihadOnTheRiver]

I do not consider myself a top player, however my advice is not debatable. There is no substitute for practice. That's what is so great about the internet. You can see a gazzillion hands. Also, although I read only one book and it was rather worthless, studying will help you a great deal.

So there you have it. The secret to success. Practice and study. Sucks, huh? GL.

-JOTR