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#11
08-09-2005, 04:46 PM
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Re: Folding for 1 bet on the river in a 17BB pot.
[ QUOTE ]
If either of them have a made hand, it's a hand that beats me. The only possible "made" hand I can think of that I beat is JQ. [/ QUOTE ] What about all of the other hands with J's in them that your opponents might be playing because they suck. This turn raise is at least as likely to be a slowplayed J as it is to be a flush or straight, in my opinion. 
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#12
08-09-2005, 04:51 PM
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Re: Folding for 1 bet on the river in a 17BB pot.
[ QUOTE ]
I just spit up my drink. [/ QUOTE ] You guys are funny. Folding on the river in big pots for one bet is not a standard play for me. But I obviously don't think it's as weak as you're making it out to be. Put yourself in my opponents places. A lot of draws were completed on the turn. What would you be raising that turn with given the action on previous streets? What are you calling two cold on the turn with? I'm not just "facing one bet on the river in a big pot." I'm "facing one bet on the river in a big pot against two players who each put two bets in on the turn after a whole bunch of draws completed, all of which beat my hand." Do you really think the button expects me (and UTG+1) to fold on the river for one bet? I seriously doubt it, and that means he's got a hand that I can't beat.
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#15
08-09-2005, 05:01 PM
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Re: Folding for 1 bet on the river in a 17BB pot.
The main thing you need to realize here is that strength displayed on the turn does not equate to strength achieved on the turn. What you could be witnessing is people coming alive with Js. Small stakes players very often do not raise the flop with flopped trips.
The two bet cold-call could very well be the result of a draw that that player just picked up. Cards that complete draws often give new draws to other players (A [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] or a 10 or something could well be calling here). Even after the turn action you should still be expecting to win more than your fair share here, particularly considering the redraws you have. River call might be "crying" in that perhaps you won't be the most likely winner but folding is totally not even within the universe of possible options that should ever be considered to be in existence.
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#16
08-09-2005, 06:12 PM
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Re: Folding for 1 bet on the river in a 17BB pot.
I think that I fold this if the pot was half the size, but there has to be at least a 6% chance that my hand is good. Certainly there could be a straight, a flush or a boat (or two of the three) out there. Indeed, its likely that I am beat -- but 95% sure I am beat?
I probably three-bet the turn as well.
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#17
08-09-2005, 06:30 PM
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Re: Folding for 1 bet on the river in a 17BB pot.
[ QUOTE ]
I think that I fold this if the pot was half the size, but there has to be at least a 6% chance that my hand is good. Certainly there could be a straight, a flush or a boat (or two of the three) out there. Indeed, its likely that I am beat -- but 95% sure I am beat? I probably three-bet the turn as well. [/ QUOTE ] Folding this river after not three-betting the turn in a pot half this size is still a massive error.
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#18
08-09-2005, 06:51 PM
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Re: Folding for 1 bet on the river in a 17BB pot.
[ QUOTE ]
What are you calling two cold on the turn with? [/ QUOTE ] I have no idea--but it is irrelevant since no one called two cold.
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