Lie Detector For Catholics.

[David Sklansky]

I've stated half jokingly that I believe that Catholics are less nuts than Protestants. Obvious reasons being their willingness to accept evolution and their willingness to accept that good non Christians can escape hell.

Others have stated that they are more nuts because of some of their silly beliefs like transubstantiation if I spelled it right.

My guess is that this paradox is resolved by the fact that most Catholics don't actually truly believe it. Social pressure makes them say otherwise. Wonder what percentage of American Catholics would pass a lie detector test that asked them if they were almost positive that transubstantiation is true?

[imported_luckyme]

[ QUOTE ]
Wonder what percentage of American Catholics would pass a lie detector test that asked them if they were almost positive that transubstantiation is true?

[/ QUOTE ]

Our minds are full of tricks and the results you get from that experiment would depend heavily on the exact wording and tone of the question(s) and the questioner.

You can do litte experiments of your own that get different answers to essentially the same question just by rewording. The abortion issue is a classic, you can get swing between the 40-60% range depending on the buried slant of the question.

In this case, when and where you asked them would play a role also ( that's part of the 'tone')

luckyme,
if I thought I was wrong, I'd change my mind

[David Sklansky]

I'm sure you are right but so what? My post was not about the accuracy of polygraphs.

[RJT]

I think it is more the case that we don’t really understand it. Nor can we really – as bigdaddy said, it is a Mystery (the capital M differs from the lower case m within our Church) Yeah, sounds like a cop-out. What can I tell you. But and without getting into the theology of it – it is a big issue among the different Christian Faiths – whether it changes or is merely a metaphor.

Had we more geniuses on board, that is believers, to help decipher the Bible it sure would help matters. But,nooooo you guys have better things to do like cure cancer – and because you are all so frigging absent-minded can’t do two things at once.

But to answer your question: I would guess the lie-detector thing would parallel the same results of - if the question were asked of one’s faith in general. Some might fail this specific question more than the general question, but I don't think it would necessarily be a significant number.

Btw, I take the 5th with both questions at this time. I am hoping to be “given” more time by God to get my act a bit more together in this regard. That is until He hooks me up to the poly. I wouldn't bet against Bluff and bigdaddy, though.

[vulturesrow]

[ QUOTE ]
I've stated half jokingly that I believe that Catholics are less nuts than Protestants. Obvious reasons being their willingness to accept evolution and their willingness to accept that good non Christians can escape hell.

Others have stated that they are more nuts because of some of their silly beliefs like transubstantiation if I spelled it right.

My guess is that this paradox is resolved by the fact that most Catholics don't actually truly believe it. Social pressure makes them say otherwise. Wonder what percentage of American Catholics would pass a lie detector test that asked them if they were almost positive that transubstantiation is true?

[/ QUOTE ]

I would pass that test. The dogma of the transubstantiation and the real presence of Christ in the Eucharist have been part of Church teaching since the beginning. Scripture and tradition give us this dogma. Yes, it is one of those faith things. But there is rational thought undergirding it, as is true of all Catholic doctrine.

[BluffTHIS!]

I think that the majority of catholics who attend Mass every sunday (i.e. not the Christmas/Easter/wedding/funeral catholics) would pass this test. One reason is that so many went to catholic schools and learned the catechism at a young age, and that doctrine is one that is stressed highly. Another reason is that if they didn't believe in transubstantiation, then they are basically a protestant and would most likely just migrate to one of those denominations, especially if they have issues with catholic teachings on divorce/birth control, etc.

I want to stress that I don't believe a lot of church-going catholics know their faith particularly well in depth, but they do know the core beliefs and that is one, even if they don't fully appreciate it.

I would bet big money that ALL the catholic supreme court justices discussed in the other thread would pass this test.

[valenzuela]

Im not sure a lie detector would work. I think many christians would fail the test and that would leave them puzzled.( according to my philosophy teacher ppl cognitive defence mechanisms are exposed on lie detector tests, Im not sure if he included rationalization but negation is certainly exposed )

[imported_luckyme]

[ QUOTE ]
I think that the majority of catholics who attend Mass every sunday (i.e. not the Christmas/Easter/wedding/funeral catholics) would pass this test.

[/ QUOTE ]

Ah, no True Scotsman. So, it needs to be decided what we mean when we say, "he's a catholic" ..only those who pass DS's lie detector test?

[imported_luckyme]

[ QUOTE ]
My post was not about the accuracy of polygraphs.

[/ QUOTE ]

Good point. I did wander too far down the "who will bell the cat?" path. Taking your question less literally I'd say the churchs offical doctrine on every topic is not ingrained in each individuals head. We choose our religion ( mightily swayed by culture/nuture) and there are only so many of them out there. Essentially you end up in one that you fit best, the beliefs of Xmillion people don't end up congruent.

luckyme,
if I thought I was wrong I'd change my mind

[BluffTHIS!]

[ QUOTE ]
So, it needs to be decided what we mean when we say, "he's a catholic" ..only those who pass DS's lie detector test?

[/ QUOTE ]

If you call yourself a member of an organization without truly believing in its principles, then you aren't really. The reason dissenting catholics stay in the church and try to change that which is unchangeable, is that they lack the integrity to declare themselves protestants and go join a different denomination, and because they would no longer be the "progressive" dissenter media darlings but just another in a long line of breakoffs from the catholic church.