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  #11  
Old 12-27-2005, 05:06 PM
benza13 benza13 is offline
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Default Re: $11: Should I even be playing?

Deeper stacks allow you to play more hands from late position, especially speculative hands like suited connectors after several limpers. Overall the tight early/aggro late strategy is still best, but you can open up your game a little more with the bigger stacks.

This will allow you to have a little more fun playing the early game. Also, as you gain more experience you will probably be able to add a second (or more) tables which will help keep things entertaining and allow you to gain experience faster.
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  #12  
Old 12-27-2005, 05:14 PM
Jbrochu Jbrochu is offline
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Default Re: $11: Should I even be playing?

[ QUOTE ]
If I'm playing in a STT with deeper stacks, which elements of the CW are equally (if not more) applicable to the optimal approach?

[/ QUOTE ]

Provided CW means "common wisdom," then yes; much of the advice posted here is geared toward the PP stucture. There are some posters who play the regular Stars format (me for one) and others who play the Stars turbos - where the blinds rise very fast but you start with a deep stack so a little more room to get involved early.

The bubble advice posted here still applies to the FTP structure, although typically you can afford to be a little more patient. Many of the posts with post-flop play will apply, especially in the middle stages where if you are going to continue after the flop most likely you will be committing the rest of your stack.

Another difference between the FTP structure and PP is that you will sometimes get heads-up with a large enough stack that moving all-in or folding are not your only options. HoH2 has excellent advice for heads-up play under these conditions.

In addition to this forum, you should also read the Pot-Limit and No-Limit forums for advice on playing when you're deep stacked.

If you're playing to improve you might also want to play the Trout tournaments every Wednesday night at Stars. You won't find competition this tough for $11 anywhere else that I'm aware of.
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  #13  
Old 12-27-2005, 05:18 PM
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Default Re: $11: Should I even be playing?

Cool. Sounds like I should move to PS once my bonus period at FTP expires, then. 75 BBs is close enough to the monthly home games my friends and I play (usually 100 to 125 BBs to start).

I can accept a more moderate version of tight early/aggro late, as it's closer to how I currently play.

[ QUOTE ]
I suggest you settle with the fact that poker is just a fun past time.

[/ QUOTE ]
Done. I fully recognize that I can't put in the necessary hours to become a good player. "Decent" is probably the more realistic option.
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  #14  
Old 12-27-2005, 05:25 PM
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Default Re: $11: Should I even be playing?

On other thing to consider is the 180 SnGs on Stars.

They seem to take around four hours to finish. If you wanted to do something bigger than a typical SnG but smaller than a really big MTT, there's your best bet.
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  #15  
Old 12-27-2005, 06:38 PM
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Default Re: $11: Should I even be playing?

I think I'm in a similar situation as you. I like ring games, but am bored unless I am working off a bonus playing 6 tables. MTTs take too long, as you say (reminded myself last night). STTs are a nice blend. Fixed length, tourny style.

Just enjoy it, but the advice here is pretty valuable, even for a game-a-night. I play at PP, PokerRoom (PR) and Ulitimate Bet (UB). Started at UB and got used to deeper stacks. Found 2+2 very helpful for when I started more at PP. They taught me to love the shorter game style of the blinds/stacks. Working a bonus at PR. Turbos are quick (30 minutes!) and standards are still only an hour, stack feels deeper at start, but it gets to pushbot mode later (and they wonder why you're doing it more than at party where people seem used to it).
You might not need PokerTracker, but do track your poker. I haven't bought PT yet, but am tempted routinely. I do have a spreadsheet where I track them. I've found tracking over long term helps shake me out of funk when I have a "huge" loss of a dozen buy-ins. Really not so bad when you realize what a blip that is, but spread out over 2 weeks, 12 losses feels terrible (takes the fun out until I realize it's a blip, and dive back in and start winning).
Beware, you might get sucked in. I went from a couple of SnGs a week to a few dozen. Fun at volume, though certainly nothing like pros.
I keep it fun, manage my bankroll (no redeposits!) and appreciate and apply the advice from here.
Welcome to the forum, see you at the tables.
-Matt
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  #16  
Old 12-27-2005, 07:28 PM
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Default Re: $11: Should I even be playing?

Thanks for the great advice, everyone. Y'all have probably accelerated my learning curve by months.

What is the profile of a $11 STT? On average, how many players at the table are:

Level 1 - can hold their own in home games, but would get absolutely destroyed against quality opposition

Level 2 - may do well in home games, but doesn't know much theory and would have a negative ROI

Level 3 - has read books like HOH, understands some theory, and would probably have a single-digit ROI

Level 4 - reads 2+2, grinding their way to a 20% ROI

Level 5 - dominates, is ready to excel at the $22s

Level 6 - god-like, is ready for the $33s or higher

Based on nothing but a hunch, I suspect that the usual table has one person from level 5/6, one from level 4, two from level 3, two from level 2, and three from level 1. Does that sound about right?

Also, what's the profile of a usual table at the $22s and $33s?
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  #17  
Old 12-27-2005, 08:35 PM
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Default Re: $11: Should I even be playing?

[ QUOTE ]
Thanks for the great advice, everyone. Y'all have probably accelerated my learning curve by months.

What is the profile of a $11 STT?

[/ QUOTE ]

30% Love to watch WSOP on TV. Think going all-in is very cool. Have watched Rounders several times, but don't understand all this talk of "rake" and "position".

20% Bought a couple of poker books and skimmed through them one night before their home games. Know that any two suited is awesome because if you hit a flush you're going to totally get someone's chips.

20% Rule their home games with big moves like bluff checkraising and slowplaying Aces preflop. Have heard some talk of pot odds, but haven't followed up because math is hard and besides their style is to "play the opponent." Own 2 or more poker t-shirts.

20% Studied up on starting hands and learned that the way to win is to start with better hands than your opponent and only bet or call with the nuts unless, of course, someone keeps raising your blind and it's making you very, very angry - in which case you call off all your chips with 5-6 offsuit to show that you can't be pushed around.

9% Play tight/aggressive ABC poker. Play extra careful on the bubble in order to secure 3rd place before trying anything "too crazy".

1% Read 2plus2 and make other opponents very upset by shoving chips at them at every opportunity on the bubble. Often get accused of "ruining the game".
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  #18  
Old 12-27-2005, 08:43 PM
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Default Re: $11: Should I even be playing?

haha this is me!

[ QUOTE ]

20% Studied up on starting hands and learned that the way to win is to start with better hands than your opponent and only bet or call with the nuts unless, of course, someone keeps raising your blind and it's making you very, very angry - in which case you call off all your chips with 5-6 offsuit to show that you can't be pushed around.


[/ QUOTE ]
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  #19  
Old 12-27-2005, 08:46 PM
Jbrochu Jbrochu is offline
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Posts: 51
Default Re: $11: Should I even be playing?

[ QUOTE ]
1% Read 2plus2 and make other opponents very upset by shoving chips at them at every opportunity on the bubble. Often get accused of "ruining the game".

[/ QUOTE ]

You will know you've made it as a player when you start getting the old "that move works every time but once" line.
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  #20  
Old 12-27-2005, 08:50 PM
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Default Re: $11: Should I even be playing?

[ QUOTE ]

You will know you've made it as a player when you start getting the old "that move works every time but once" line.

[/ QUOTE ]

Damn. I haven't gotten that one. When I do, I plan on typing, "Is this the one time you get me?" before I shove.

Today I got, "Greedy, aren't you?" after shoving into BB for the 5th straight rotation. Kinda made me chuckle.
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