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  #21  
Old 12-26-2005, 05:00 PM
Dagger78 Dagger78 is offline
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Default Re: PF raise with QJs?

Raise about any two in this situation, even if the SB calls you're in good position. You're getting 2.5-1 on the raise, 4.5-1 or 5-1 on the flop bet, and sometimes you'll just make the best hand and win.
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  #22  
Old 12-26-2005, 05:04 PM
Dagger78 Dagger78 is offline
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Default Re: PF raise with QJs?

I think this is a pretty good hand all around. The small blind's flop CR sucked, but that's not gonna happen THAT often. The river action is sick...

I'm totally confused as to what UTG had, sb flopped a set I'm assuming.
Only thing I can imagine is UTG had A9 and decided to LAG up the river.
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  #23  
Old 12-26-2005, 05:12 PM
SackUp SackUp is offline
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Default Re: PF raise with QJs?

preflop raise is SuPER easy. I'd consider capping it though. For the same reason we raise in the first place - we have a huge equity edge multiway. We lose some highcard value given we were 3bet but our straight and FD are HUGE! Wouldn't it be fantastic if we get a free card on this flop and then get to play a cheap turn and blow them up on the river [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

The only street that is close is the flop, but getting 12:1 on a GS and a bdfd I think we are more than fine to call this.

Rest of the hand is standard.
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  #24  
Old 12-26-2005, 05:59 PM
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Default Re: PF raise with QJs?

[ QUOTE ]
I should add that the blinds were loose passives as were the limpers, and that button was a TAG.


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That erases any doubt about the PF raise.

[ QUOTE ]
Although if table was different, should I still raise this PF for some sort of equity edge? I was never quite clear about raising PF in multiway pots with certain hands (like j10s, mid pockets, etc.)

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Not my expertise either, but I say QJs is worth a raise in late position after 3 limpers even when you don't know your opponents. With at least 4 opp. to see the flop, and the fact that you have both suited connectors and top pair draws a raise is good. Has a great chance of buying the button and allowing you to take the free card. My reservation, though, is: how often will we win here with top pair? I think we will often enough to make raising profitable, but JTs is the worse hand for which this has value. (I'd like to hear any arguments against that). 98s~54s just check to the flop 6 handed.

Pocket pairs, CO, 3 limpers, new to table:

If you raise:
Probably 4 oponents.
set draw is less profitable.
99 more winnable UI.
opponents will check to you on the flop if they do not hit, but will call with as much as one over.
If a different opponents leads a flop with high card(s) the hand is easy to play.
bigger pot: harder to force opponents to fold overs.

No raise:
probably 5 opponents.
set draw will have value.
less likely to win UI.
Someone else will lead the flop allowing you to make it two bets (can protect your hand easier).
Small pot: easier to force overs to fold.

With that in mind, I say raise TT, call(check) 88, and might as well mix it up a little.
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  #25  
Old 12-26-2005, 06:01 PM
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Default Re: PF raise with QJs?

My money's on A7 for UTG
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  #26  
Old 12-26-2005, 06:12 PM
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Default Re: PF raise with QJs?

Why are we raising this hand preflop, we are in awful position to control a draw and I also don't think we have enough equity to call the 3bet on the flop.
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  #27  
Old 12-26-2005, 07:01 PM
Xhad Xhad is offline
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Default Re: PF raise with QJs?

[ QUOTE ]
Why are we raising this hand preflop, we are in awful position to control a draw

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Awful position? You have the second best absolute position possible! Also, you probably have an equity edge regardless of the identity of the limpers.

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and I also don't think we have enough equity to call the 3bet on the flop.

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Time to go study basic pot odds. You're getting 13-to-1 immediate odds, which is more than enough for your gutshot alone considering it's to the nuts. The possibility of a cap behind you is not enough to swing the call to unprofitable because of your BDFD.
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  #28  
Old 12-26-2005, 09:16 PM
UCLAseetoK UCLAseetoK is offline
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Default Re: PF raise with QJs?

UTG had 77.
SB had A8o.
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  #29  
Old 12-26-2005, 09:37 PM
W. Deranged W. Deranged is offline
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Default Re: PF raise with QJs?

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
This hand sucks on all streets.

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If by sucks you mean played well, then I agree.

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Agreed. This hand is perfectly played on every street. Where would hero do anything else?
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  #30  
Old 12-26-2005, 11:21 PM
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Default Re: PF raise with QJs? NC

[ QUOTE ]
Also, any flames on the way the hand was played, seemed like I had odds to be calling on all streets (be it implied or immediate).


[/ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]


If by sucks you mean played well, then I agree.


[ QUOTE ]

Agreed. This hand is perfectly played on every street. Where would hero do anything else?


[/ QUOTE ]


[/ QUOTE ]
Hope we haven't been too harsh on OP.
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