23s ...I know, I know: Fold PF

[Redd]

[ QUOTE ]
I would play either in the SB without a second thought. Here it costs .5SB more...

[/ QUOTE ]

This seems like a slippery slope situation.

[ QUOTE ]
we still have 1.5 outs to trips, 2 outs to two pair, 3 outs to a straight, and 1 out to a backdoor flush.

[/ QUOTE ]

You don't think we're being too generous with the outs to bottom two that put a 4-straight on, and outs to the nut-low end of a one-card straight with an OESD on board? Both in a large field?

[thejameser]

[ QUOTE ]
I don't understand why you raised the flop; this doesn't seem like a good place to push bottom pair. You've got a bunch of loose opponents, a weak-tight calling with something, very tainted outs and you need to dodge every card in the deck twice over.

[/ QUOTE ]

call it a semi bluff with a gutshot and a pair with bd flush potential if it makes you feel better. i could face most of the field with 2 and the fewer i have in the hand, the more my equity, no? i really wanted the free card, though.

[SeaEagle]

[ QUOTE ]
I don't understand why you raised the flop; this doesn't seem like a good place to push bottom pair. You've got a bunch of loose opponents, a weak-tight calling with something, very tainted outs and you need to dodge every card in the deck twice over.

[/ QUOTE ]
If you're going to play this flop, then you need to raise and try to knock some people out. All of hero's outs are tainted and, for instance, knocking out a UI 7x (that will have odds to draw for a single bet) can buy 4 full outs in a big pot.

[Yads]

I like it. Good raise on the flop hopefully folding out a 7 to buy some outs to your ass end straight.

[Octopus]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I would play either in the SB without a second thought. Here it costs .5SB more...

[/ QUOTE ]

This seems like a slippery slope situation.

[/ QUOTE ]
You left out the part about having position in a passive field. That is important.

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
we still have 1.5 outs to trips, 2 outs to two pair, 3 outs to a straight, and 1 out to a backdoor flush.

[/ QUOTE ]

You don't think we're being too generous with the outs to bottom two that put a 4-straight on, and outs to the nut-low end of a one-card straight with an OESD on board? Both in a large field?

[/ QUOTE ]

OK. Call it 1.5 out to the straight. While we are at it, the trip outs are probably closer to 1.8 outs. Or whatever. How does this change my argument? We are not folding; raising is better than calling.

[J_V]

Preflop is a good call. Flop raise is probably bad. River raise is good.