Creativity test

[arkady]

what is all this information mumbo jumbo. it is called being deceptive.

you cap w/JJ and get raised C/Red on A/K/Q high flop, toss it. who needs information. Also, don't kid yourself, you aint folding JJ on unders anyway. info shminfo.

as for missing value w/AA. Its possible but UTG knows that he got 3-bet by a maniac and might just as easily cap his AQ for value. My 3 cold looks weak. This is not about information, stop thinking so 1 dimensionally. This is about deception and with position this is $$$$$.

[Isura]

Maybe I'm putting too much importance on information, but I think you are doing the same thing with deception. The pot will be atleast 3 way (with the blinds still unaccounted), with 1 known maniac in the hand. Hence you are more likely than average to get a lot of action when you hit, regardless of the preflop action. Deception become less important the bigger the pot is, and the more people are in the hand. With 1 raiser and the blinds left I agree much more with your play. And like you said, we have the best position here. Isn't that more reason to guarantee that this pot gets capped preflop? Please let me know where my thinking is wrong. I'm not being a smart-ass, just trying to learn.

[joker122]

[ QUOTE ]
The reason we cap JJ is to push UTG out, its easy to play it in position we dont really need that info. I would rather get utg to fold AQ.

[/ QUOTE ]

when's the last time you saw someone raise pf and then fold for 2 more in a 5/10 or 10/20 6m game?

[arkady]

Just because you never do it, does not mean it does not happen. I have seen and I have done it.

[arkady]

You are starting to refocus on capping AA in general. I meerely corrected krish's post by saying that in the particular situation (with UTG capping anyway) I cap JJ and 3-bet AA. The original poster is asking for some funky situation where I would do this. Krish then came up with a very specific setup and I chimed in on how I would play that very specific situation. Because both the OP and Krish are talking about freak occurences, it doesnt really matter what the hell anyone does.

Personally I would shut out as many people as I can w/JJ and that generally extends to how I play. I dont remember the last time I cold called 3 w/AA, but I be this would be the spot.

[krishanleong]

Just so we are clear, I said UTG would only cap overpairs. Not cap all the time.

With the JJ hand I wouldn't cap for two reasons, 1 to determine if UTG had a pair and 2 since the maniac would autobet every flop, a flop CR would protect a semi-vunerable hand.

Krishan

[Isura]

Yeah, I kind of rambled about general theory in the last post. I agree with wanting to shut out people with JJ, so capping is something I might do if I felt people could fold stuff like AQ-KQ for 2 or 3 bets. It's an interesting idea to keep in mind though (calling AA in this spot). My comments are biased though because at the limits I play, there is rarely a reason to not put in as many bets as possible with AA-KK.

[IGMorton]

^

[joker122]

why the personal attack?

and you're simply wrong by implying that players often make this fold.

[motorholdem]

[ QUOTE ]
heh...

i would rather cap JJ there and call 3 w/AA.

[/ QUOTE ]

I agree. If I have loose agros, and I am on the button, I like Cold-calling the 3 bet with AA. The reaons is no-one is folding for the extra bet at that point, so why reveal strength to loose players. I want them to raise like crazy with thier AQos when a queen boards.

I disagree with whoever said this is a sucker's play. I say let them wonder what I have when I 'really" cap it later in the game.

If the players are tight, I am capping, for obvious reasons.