AA , am i beat?

[leehrat]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

calling gives me no idea of where im at.


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------



play chess then


????

[/ QUOTE ]

poker is a game of incomplete information, you can't get information without giving information. You're much better off not knowing where you stand than telling your opponent where he stands

[/ QUOTE ]

i totally disagree with this statement.

[Fallen Hero]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

calling gives me no idea of where im at.


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------



play chess then


????

[/ QUOTE ]

poker is a game of incomplete information, you can't get information without giving information. You're much better off not knowing where you stand than telling your opponent where he stands

[/ QUOTE ]

i totally disagree with this statement.

[/ QUOTE ]

ok. so the flop comes QQx, he bets, you raise. Now he folds, great, you got all the information you wanted, your hand is good. Of course if you hadn't raise you give him the opportunity to lose more with a second best hand.
If you are behind you don't need to lose more but you greatly improve your chances of seeing a showdown AND you win a lot more when you're ahead (giving freecards is not a problem)

Raising purely for information is bad.

[ QUOTE ]
ok. so the flop comes QQx, he bets, you raise. Now he folds, great, you got all the information you wanted, your hand is good. Of course if you hadn't raise you give him the opportunity to lose more with a second best hand.

[/ QUOTE ]
What second best hand is putting any more money into this pot? Any hand that is calling bets on future streets is calling a flop raise.

Edit: removed some content because I forgot what the original hand was

[Fallen Hero]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
ok. so the flop comes QQx, he bets, you raise. Now he folds, great, you got all the information you wanted, your hand is good. Of course if you hadn't raise you give him the opportunity to lose more with a second best hand.

[/ QUOTE ]
What second best hand is putting any more money into this pot? Any hand that is calling bets on future streets is calling a flop raise.

Edit: removed some content because I forgot what the original hand was

[/ QUOTE ]

TT bets the flop, gets called. check check on turn. you value bet the river after being checked to, he looks you up about 90% of the time (or makes a blocking bet himself).

[leehrat]

so then he keeps betting the turn and river and you just call both times and have no clue where you stand unless he makes a monster bet. great.

[Fallen Hero]

[ QUOTE ]
so then he keeps betting the turn and river and you just call both times and have no clue where you stand unless he makes a monster bet. great.

[/ QUOTE ]

why do you assume you call the turn and river? Play some poker

[ QUOTE ]
TT min-bets the flop, gets called. check check on turn. you value bet the river after being checked to, he looks you up about 50% of the time

[/ QUOTE ]
FYP, and you just won a massive $3 pot. Calling that minbet is effectively checking behind on that flop.

If TT min bets and you raise, TT is probably calling. Turn Check/check, river check/call, you just won an extra $4 bucks (double the pot).

Edit re. TT calling the flop raise: in my experience, a min bet means absolutely nothing more than a check. Villain checked the flop. If he raises TT (unlikely) then you fold, shucks, we just folded the best hand on a [censored] flop. move on, [censored] happens.

If AQ min bets and you raise, he is either 3betting (easy fold) or smooth calling and leading turn (easy fold). If a queen doesnt bet the turn, make a note on the stupid donkey and move on.

[Fallen Hero]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
TT min-bets the flop, gets called. check check on turn. you value bet the river after being checked to, he looks you up about 50% of the time

[/ QUOTE ]
FYP, and you just won a massive $3 pot. Calling that minbet is effectively checking behind on that flop.

If TT min bets and you raise, TT is probably calling. Turn Check/check, river check/call, you just won an extra $4 bucks (double the pot).

Edit re. TT calling the flop raise: in my experience, a min bet means absolutely nothing more than a check. Villain checked the flop. If he raises TT (unlikely) then you fold, shucks, we just folded the best hand on a [censored] flop. move on, [censored] happens.

If AQ min bets and you raise, he is either 3betting (easy fold) or smooth calling and leading turn (easy fold). If a queen doesnt bet the turn, make a note on the stupid donkey and move on.

[/ QUOTE ]

if you're folding TT 50% of the time on the river you'll lose a LOT of pots, that's not my experience at all. And it's also not very commum to see TT calling on that flop (and imagine it isn't TT, rather 66, do you still think he calls?).

Specifics apart (we could invent situations all day to prove our points) raising purely for information is BAD.

66 is check folding most any flop without a six in it.
I'll agree to disagree. We're splitting hairs over a tiny pot, we both can agree that we certainly won't be winning a lot of money with this flop.