10/20 - Protecting my hand in a big pot, taking it too far?

spamuell · #1 05-17-2005, 09:26 AM

At the time I played this hand I didn't know the opponents that well yet but I knew UTG was limping with lots of trash (which made me more reluctant to do this on the turn) and that the button was quite loose and aggro.

Party Poker 10/20 Hold'em (6 max, 5 handed) converter

Preflop: Hero is SB with A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 6[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img].
UTG calls, MP raises, Button calls, Hero calls, 1 fold, UTG calls.

Flop: (9 SB) 2[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 3[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], T[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (4 players)
Hero bets, UTG raises, MP calls, Button 3-bets, Hero calls, UTG calls, MP calls.

Turn: (10.50 BB) 6[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (4 players)
Hero checks, UTG checks, MP checks, Button bets, Hero raises

I'm almost always behind here aren't I? Is it worth the extra bet to protect my hand the times I'm not? Also there's a chance that UTG will fold 77-99 or even a weak T and that button is just betting because it's a huge pot and it was checked to him (EDIT: Ok, he 3-bet the flop, there isn't really. But the pot is so big, I still think this might be worth it). I'm not desperately worried about MP, I can't see him checking an overpair on the turn and I figure that if he was slowplaying something then 2 bets are probably going in on the turn anyway but unless he has TT then not three.
Comments?

mperich · #2 05-17-2005, 09:31 AM

I don't like it. You are behind a fair amount of the time and you have tons of outs if you are, but you would like the other two to come along if they will. You aren't cleaning up any outs, and you arent good enough % to make this raise imo.

-Mike

krishanleong · #3 05-17-2005, 09:36 AM

Posting blind.

Horrible.

Things to consider,

1. You are almost always behind. No point in protecting the worst hand.
2. You now reverse dominate aces.
3. You have a solid draw and don't want to blast everyone out of the pot.

Who exactly do you want to fold in this spot? I could see more of a case for raise if you didn't pair the 6. Not that the case would be strong even then.

Krishan

stigmata · #4 05-17-2005, 09:38 AM

No, I don't see what this achieves. You don't need to clean up your ace outs now. Keep drawing and get the overcalls. Nobody with a better hand is going anywhere.

MAxx · #5 05-17-2005, 09:46 AM

the flushpumper in me has to ask whether we can cap the flop....

PokerBob · #6 05-17-2005, 09:49 AM

[ QUOTE ]
the flushpumper in me has to ask whether we can cap the flop....

[/ QUOTE ]

I think you're gonna lose the other 2 players, so the value isn't there. That said, a flop cap may force MP2 to dump a better ace, thus cleaning up our A outs. I guess it could go either way.

spamuell · #7 05-17-2005, 09:54 AM

Yeah, you guys are right, thanks. I do this sometimes when I have the second best hand in a big pot in a desperate attempt to win it. I can't imagine it's a big leak because those situations are rare and it's hard for it to be a big leak when the pot is so big, but thanks, I should recognise it.

To Krishan:

[ QUOTE ]

Posting blind.

Horrible.

[/ QUOTE ]

What? I was the SB? Do you mean you don't like the pf call?

MAxx · #8 05-17-2005, 09:55 AM

i was kinda thinking that this maybe a good spot b/c utg and mp already put in two, so i think that they will normally put in 2 more.

i would like it more if there was another player around...

stigmata · #9 05-17-2005, 09:59 AM

Krishan meant that he was posting blind (to other peoples responses), LOL [img]/images/graemlins/laugh.gif[/img]

krishanleong · #10 05-17-2005, 10:11 AM

[ QUOTE ]
I do this sometimes when I have the second best hand in a big pot in a desperate attempt to win it. I can't imagine it's a big leak

[/ QUOTE ]

Oh it can hold you back. I know I went through a SSHE phase where I checkraised every button bet with bottom pair hoping they were on a draw. All in all it doesn't work well.

Krishan