variance with GSIH short stack system

[mosquito]

Hi. First post this forum, don't know what has and
has not been discussed.

Did look back 50-60 posts or so, not sure what to
search for.

Am a NL 'rookie', and thought I'd play around with
Miller's GSIH short stack system.

Seems to be lots of variance, I stated out super
hot, then recently all the 2-5 outers hit against
me. Hard to know how I'm 'supposed to be' running,
or if this swingy-ness is somewhat normal?

Anyhow, thoughts and comments appreciated. I am
up $$$, it just doesn't feel like it.... [img]/images/graemlins/mad.gif[/img]

Also, how many buy-ins (short) should I expect
to be a 'safe' bankroll?

Thanks [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img] [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

[Reef]

welcome to the forums.

I personally don't recommend any short stack all in system (which is my guess as to what you're talking about doing). I also don't know of any good players who use this system. I'd pick up some books and work on post-flop play.

[mosquito]

[ QUOTE ]
welcome to the forums.

I personally don't recommend any short stack all in system (which is my guess as to what you're talking about doing). I also don't know of any good players who use this system. I'd pick up some books and work on post-flop play.

[/ QUOTE ]

Thanks. <bump>

I intend to do that, but am still interested in an
answer to my query. Apparantly no one here has much
experience with a short-stack system. Feel free to
speak if you have!

[BZ_Zorro]

[ QUOTE ]
Apparantly no one here has much experience with a short-stack system.

[/ QUOTE ]
No offence to Miller, but imo that's because the short stack system is silly. The promise of free money without thought, effort or risk has lured in suckers and sold books since the invention of the printing press, but they usually end up frustrated or broke.

If you follow this system you'll be grinding out peanuts, and that's only if the players don't counteract your system. I've stacked so many short stacks and their rebuys because they were following a blind system instead of reading my play.

If you haven't got much, use your short stack to buy in full at a lower level (tables go as low as .01/.02 online), and learn some poker. You'll lose a few buy ins but after a while your earn will be comparable to any short stack system at higher stakes. Learn some poker, earn your money, then move up. I can guarantee you the guys at mid-high didn't start off playing short stack strategy.

[Aytumious]

[ QUOTE ]
Hi. First post this forum, don't know what has and
has not been discussed.

Did look back 50-60 posts or so, not sure what to
search for.

Am a NL 'rookie', and thought I'd play around with
Miller's GSIH short stack system.

Seems to be lots of variance, I stated out super
hot, then recently all the 2-5 outers hit against
me. Hard to know how I'm 'supposed to be' running,
or if this swingy-ness is somewhat normal?

Anyhow, thoughts and comments appreciated. I am
up $$$, it just doesn't feel like it.... [img]/images/graemlins/mad.gif[/img]

Also, how many buy-ins (short) should I expect
to be a 'safe' bankroll?

Thanks [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img] [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

[/ QUOTE ]

I'd suggest playing some small buyin SNG's to get a feel for the game. Despite the fact it is tournament poker, you get to play many hands for a small amount of money while also getting experience in many different situations. I think it would be easier to learn the NL game playing some SNG's as opposed to a short stack strategy.

[theben]

it is a shame nobody has actually answered your questions, rather they just tell you to do something else.

i will make an attempt to give you some answers. however, take my warning: i do not use the GSIH short buyin strat and therefore, i may be incorrect.

First off, i beleive there will be less variance than playing a full stack. when you lose, you have a large limit on how badly you lose. when you win, you only win a max for 20-25bb's net. you'll also be playing very tightly and often showing down a hand. therefore, i would assume your variance should be much lower.

as for a bankroll req., on a buyin to buyin basis, you'll be much more prone to losing a buyin all at once. (but remeber, losing 5 'short' buyins is the same as losing one full buyin). so you'll need more than normally advised 15-20 100bb stack buyins.

I would think 40, maybe 50 buyins should be sufficient.

[BZ_Zorro]

[ QUOTE ]
it is a shame nobody has actually answered your questions, rather they just tell you to do something else.

[/ QUOTE ]
True, apologies to OP. I just hate the short stacked system, it's a bad way to play and a bad way to learn poker IMO.

[theben]

i also do not like the shortstacked systems either. but they should have some merit situationally. they probably are a better way to let a weaker player play NLHE cash games and lose less

[mosquito]

[ QUOTE ]
i also do not like the shortstacked systems either. but they should have some merit situationally. they probably are a better way to let a weaker player play NLHE cash games and lose less

[/ QUOTE ]

Do you think Miller would say that it is a (normally)
winning system if it is not?

I have played some SNG's off and on. Not the same thing.

I have played some mid & large stack NL as well, just
not alot.

I have quite a bit of experience at limit, and at other
forms of poker.

The .01-.02 blind NL games are ridiculous. There is
very little to be learned from them that, that I do
not already know. It's mostly a showdown feast.

Granted, short stack systems are not going to do that
much either, except that it does allow a player to
observe normal action at a higher buy-in while
maintaining some profitability and gaining a feel
for the game and opponents.

Beats the heck out of spending hours observing,
which BTW I have done as well at LV tables.

I am not stating that the short stack is an end,
or that it should be.

I guess no one knows an answer, which is too bad.

Perhaps I or someone else will eventually have one.

mosquito

[mosquito]

[ QUOTE ]
it is a shame nobody has actually answered your questions, rather they just tell you to do something else.

i will make an attempt to give you some answers. however, take my warning: i do not use the GSIH short buyin strat and therefore, i may be incorrect.

First off, i beleive there will be less variance than playing a full stack. when you lose, you have a large limit on how badly you lose. when you win, you only win a max for 20-25bb's net. you'll also be playing very tightly and often showing down a hand. therefore, i would assume your variance should be much lower.

as for a bankroll req., on a buyin to buyin basis, you'll be much more prone to losing a buyin all at once. (but remeber, losing 5 'short' buyins is the same as losing one full buyin). so you'll need more than normally advised 15-20 100bb stack buyins.

I would think 40, maybe 50 buyins should be sufficient.

[/ QUOTE ]

Actually your loss is limit to the 20-25 bet buy-in, but
I have tripled up several times already.

And if there is less variance, why would I need more
buy ins? Makes no sense. Thought 20 buy ins was std.