Staking a buddy (take 2)

[Marlow]

Here's the short version: I staked a friend 2k. I got 25% plus all his rakeback (if he loses, it's on me). Two weeks in he was up and cashed out 1,100 (for bills). I took 25% of that as well. Then he lost the rest. Interestingly, between the rakeback and the money from the cashout, I've gotten a return of exactly 2k. Now what the hell do I do?

Do we just start over? Would you alter the deal? How do you feel about him cashing out only part of his winnings like that?

Thanks for your help.

[dogmeat]

Not trying to be a jerk here, but you made the first deal without any help - why are you asking 2+2 for help now?

Dogmeat [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]

[jman220]

[ QUOTE ]
Here's the short version: I staked a friend 2k. I got 25% plus all his rakeback (if he loses, it's on me). Two weeks in he was up and cashed out 1,100 (for bills). I took 25% of that as well. Then he lost the rest. Interestingly, between the rakeback and the money from the cashout, I've gotten a return of exactly 2k. Now what the hell do I do?

Do we just start over? Would you alter the deal? How do you feel about him cashing out only part of his winnings like that?

Thanks for your help.

[/ QUOTE ]

He generated roughly $1750 in rakeback off of a $2k roll? Over what period of time? Sounds to me like he was playing way over his bankroll.

Edit: Unless he was like 8-tabling 3/6 or something like that.

This is why you can't have an ambigous statement in an agreement such as he will pay you 25%. 25% of what? Each time he cashes out, every year 25% of his bankroll? Every month? For life? Until he gets a certain bankroll for himself?

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Here's the short version: I staked a friend 2k. I got 25% plus all his rakeback (if he loses, it's on me). Two weeks in he was up and cashed out 1,100 (for bills). I took 25% of that as well. Then he lost the rest. Interestingly, between the rakeback and the money from the cashout, I've gotten a return of exactly 2k. Now what the hell do I do?

Do we just start over? Would you alter the deal? How do you feel about him cashing out only part of his winnings like that?

Thanks for your help.

[/ QUOTE ]

He generated roughly $1750 in rakeback off of a $2k roll? Over what period of time? Sounds to me like he was playing way over his bankroll.

Edit: Unless he was like 8-tabling 3/6 or something like that.

[/ QUOTE ]

I was also wondering the same thing by the way. If he is the type of player to play over his head, which it seems may be the case, then I wouldn't lend money at all. You should monitor your investment. Check his PT every day [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

Also, when he cashed out, the 75% should still be in play for you. He should put that money back online and continue playing low stakes until he can build a roll of his own.

[Marlow]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Here's the short version: I staked a friend 2k. I got 25% plus all his rakeback (if he loses, it's on me). Two weeks in he was up and cashed out 1,100 (for bills). I took 25% of that as well. Then he lost the rest. Interestingly, between the rakeback and the money from the cashout, I've gotten a return of exactly 2k. Now what the hell do I do?

Do we just start over? Would you alter the deal? How do you feel about him cashing out only part of his winnings like that?

Thanks for your help.

[/ QUOTE ]

He generated roughly $1750 in rakeback off of a $2k roll? Over what period of time? Sounds to me like he was playing way over his bankroll.

Edit: Unless he was like 8-tabling 3/6 or something like that.

[/ QUOTE ]

Interesting. I'm not a limit player, so I know nothing about how quickly rakeback is accumulated. But knowing him, he was probably playing well above the roll.

[Marlow]

Actually, I did ask for help. That's where I got the idea to take rakeback.

And I need help now because something here is broken and I can't quite piece it together. I want to give him more help, but I don't want to expose myself to unnecessary risk either.

[Marlow]

[ QUOTE ]
This is why you can't have an ambigous statement in an agreement such as he will pay you 25%. 25% of what? Each time he cashes out, every year 25% of his bankroll? Every month? For life? Until he gets a certain bankroll for himself?

[/ QUOTE ]

Yeah. I didn't see that this would be a problem going into it.

[ QUOTE ]
But knowing him, he was probably playing well above the roll.

[/ QUOTE ]

Then this is a poor investment and most likely a sunk cost of $2K for you. I wouldn't lend him more money.

First off, your message is a bit confusing to me. He cashed out $1,100 from which you received 25%, or $275. Where does the remaining $1,725 come from, rakeback? If so, did he pay you 25% of his rakeback or 100% of it? Either way does not make much sense, and funding your playing through rakeback is not the sign of a winning player that you should stake. It seems more realistic that he lost $900 playing poker and found another way to pay you back the $2k, thus saving embarrassment and financial guilt (even though the agreement was that you would risk a 100% loss). Just a guess.

Edit: I noticed that a few other posters responded with the preceding question. It’s obviously an important factor to understand.

On another note, you earned 0% on your investment over an unknown period of time. There are plenty of low risk bonds, funds, etc, that you can invest in for >0% return.

And finally, why would your friend need staking if he is a winning player? It sounds to me, from the facts given, that he is a troubled gambler playing outside of his limits. Stay away.

-Andrew