Stars $30+3 killer hand.

Hello everyone. I've been lurking here for a short while but this is my first post on 2+2 so be nice, please [img]/images/graemlins/crazy.gif[/img].

I played this hand on another computer so I will not be able to post a HH but I remember the hand in detail anyway.

Stars $30+3 tour, I have accumulated quite a nice stack - the blinds are 200/400 with a 25 ante and I have ~8.5k in my stack; the average stack is about 5k. I have just been moved to a new table and judging by the few hands I've seen its a pretty tight table, save for the semi-tilted guy two seats to my right who has lost 3 pots in a row, one of them a failed bluff attempt.

It is folded to me in late MP and I raise with 75s to 1200 in order to pick up the blinds. It is folded to the aforementioned guy in CO (with about 15k) who makes it 3200. Now, this is where I should have folded and given up my attempt to take down the blinds and ante but I call and figures he has two high cards since he has raised about the same amount earlier and showed AQ, AJ and a low pocket pair. My plan is to stop-go with my remaining 5k if the flop does not seem to connect with his hand distribution.

Flop comes down T82, one of my suit. I reluctantly push my last 5k into the ~7k pot. He calls with AQo. I pick up an open-ended straight draw on the turn but alas, the river is a brick, and I am out.

What do you guys think? I am not sure if this is a terrible play or if it just was really ignorant of me to try to pull it off against the one guy at the table that has showed that he was at least on semi-tilt.

[rockythecat99]

This is not terrible. Yes I think you should have folded preflop. I think this stop and go works on anyone on your table but this guy. Why? Because he is tilting and is pissed off and will call with ace high. Stay away from these players for bluffing and value bet them to death. Welcome to the forums [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

[Slow Play Ray]

i would like to be nice, but:

a) you shouldn't have raised
b) you shouldn't have called the re-raise
c) you shouldn't have pushed the flop, particularly against a known tilter

really, i don't like anything about this hand. bluffing off all of your chips is the worst way i can think of to bust out of a tourney...particularly when you were sitting with a much higher than average stack and there was no reason for you to do so. the stop-n-go is a strategy intended for situations where you are out of options.

Thank you for your reply.

Yes, you are both right - this was not a good play and I felt really bad about loosing my nice stack with 75s when there was only 150 players left.

This is a recurring problem in MTTs for me. Basically, I've been playing NL cash games for a couple of years but I am new to MTTs. I guess this "I can always rebuy if this hand does not work out" feeling is rooted somewhere deep inside of me. Note to self: I can't rebuy in MTTs.

Thank you for your input.

[Slow Play Ray]

To be fair, I used to have this problem, and I suspect most new MTT players do as well - you really just have to learn to discipline yourself.

When I make a questionable raise/play, I always starting thinking "I will NOT bluff off all of my chips if I miss/get played back at." As much as it hurts the ego, you have to add the check/fold to your repertoire, particularly when literally almost ANYTHING can beat your hand.

Keep reading here and participating, and definitely keep posting hands like this - if our berating doesn't snap you out of it, nothing will!

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luffing off all of your chips is the worst way i can think of to bust out of a tourney

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I'm sorry but I couldn't disagree more. There is no shame in being aggressive and pushing your chips in on a bluff and losing. I'd much rather bluff off my stack than get blinded away - the worst way I can think of to bust out of a tourney.

That being said, you shouldn't go bluff crazy. There are definetly times that it should be done and players it should be done agaisnt.

A player who has just lost 3 pots in a row is not the player to bluff against. He also has twice the chips you have. So he is on tilt and you don't represent a huge threat to his stack as you can't cripple him.

Don't be ashamed to bust out on a bluff. If you think the only way to get someone to laydown is to put all your chips in and you're 90%(or whatever % makes the move right) sure they will then put them in and don't worry about the times you go out.

However if you find that every tourney you get bounced out of is on a bluff, you have taken this too far. But if most of the time you have the best hand when the money went in and on occasion somebody caught you bluffing... there's always another tourney starting soon.

[Slow Play Ray]

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bluffing off all of your chips is the worst way i can think of to bust out of a tourney

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I'm sorry but I couldn't disagree more. There is no shame in being aggressive and pushing your chips in on a bluff and losing. I'd much rather bluff off my stack than get blinded away - the worst way I can think of to bust out of a tourney.

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Maybe I should have been more specific and said "bluffing off all of your chips when you have a decent stack is the worst way I can think of to bust out of a tourney." If you bluff off 6 BB when you're in danger of busting, that's a different story. But OP bluffed off 21 BB w/ almost 0% chance of having the best hand against a tilter that was almost guaranteed to call - sorry, but there is no excuse for that.

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bluffing off all of your chips is the worst way i can think of to bust out of a tourney

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I'm sorry but I couldn't disagree more. There is no shame in being aggressive and pushing your chips in on a bluff and losing. I'd much rather bluff off my stack than get blinded away - the worst way I can think of to bust out of a tourney.

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maybe i should have been more specific and said "bluffing off all of your chips when you have a decent stack is the worst way i can think of to bust out of a tourney"

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Tough to bluff someone off a hand when you don't have a decent stack. If you can't put them to a decision for their chips then you lose a lot of the effectivness of your bluff.

[Slow Play Ray]

Well...I guess it's just a matter of opinion of how you'd rather bust out.

I busted out of too many tournaments early in my career - tournaments I was in position to finish well in - by bluffing at pots I had no business being in, so it holds a particularly sour spot in my heart. I learned my lesson - my MTT game has improved dramatically since I got away from these indiscretions.

I am not saying there is not a time and a place for bluffing, because believe me, I certainly do my share - it is the situations like this where you had no business being there to begin with that I am referring to.

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Well...I guess it's just a matter of opinion of how you'd rather bust out.

I busted out of too many tournaments early in my career - tournaments I was in position to finish well in - by bluffing at pots I had no business being in, so it holds a particularly sour spot in my heart. I learned my lesson - my MTT game has improved dramatically since I got away from these indiscretions.

I am not saying there is not a time and a place for bluffing, because believe me, I certainly do my share - it is the situations like this where you had no business being there to begin with that I am referring to.

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Yeah, I've been there too. I think for beginers the best line may be to almost never bluff. Not counting your usual continuation bets or probing bets. But once you have advanced your game, you need to trust your reads and put the chips in.

Like I said if you find you're going out in most tourney's on a bluff... you need to take a step back.