Paris riots spread, shaking French government

[Jdanz]

islam i think the anti-islamisism on this board is pretty dumb, given that, islam didn't exist for like a thousand years after plato and aristotle.

[adios]

Newt was on O'Reilly yesterday being highly critical of Chirac and his government. Basically he stated that he'd ship all the malcontents back to Africa or wherever they came from. If I'm not mistaken alot of rioters were born in France but could be wrong about that. Anyway he was stating also that he'd advocate withholding federal aid to any state or city in the U.S. that didn't uphold the rule of law. I think he's going to run in 2008.

There has certainly been quite a few of the trumpeteers of socialism talking out of their ass in regards to the attempts of countries like France to assimilate immigrants into a multi-cultural society and America's lack thereof. At least, so this French article begs to differ (bottom)

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Arab and Muslim immigrants in the US generally identify themselves as Americans and integrate with relative ease into a society that prides itself on social mobility and has more tolerance for cultural and religious differences, Haddad said.

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"To identify as French you have to renounce your

faith and have to renounce you previous identity as though your previous self didn't exist. In the US you don't have to," she said.

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"There's no clear connection between the European and the American Muslim experience," she said, explaining that Muslims in the United States are less isolated and homogeneous than their European counterpart.

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http://www.expatica.com/source/site_arti...+US+than+France

[ilikeaces]

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France is trying to build a multicultural society. Multiculturalism is the only way for the future. Leading a country in that direction requires courage, and the French leaders possess that courage. However, Paris is a big city with big differences between rich and poor and severe social problems, and much of the immigrants end up in these sort of ghettos. The French government seems overstretched when facing these problems.

But, they have succeded in turning France in a multicultural direction. The common American prejudices (in common I don't mean everybody) towards many other cultures are not very present in France. More France-like countries and less conservative religious countries like US; and this world would be better.

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I disagree with every point you just made. In fact I would say the complete opposite of everything you just said. I guess that makes u bizzaro Aces.

[The once and future king]

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islam didn't exist for like a thousand years after plato and aristotle.

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So?

[Cyrus]

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There has certainly been quite a few of the trumpeteers of socialism talking out of their ass in regards to the attempts of countries like France to assimilate immigrants into a multi-cultural society and America's lack thereof.

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France, along with most European countries, have a confused immigration policy. The confusion has nothing to do with socialism or capitalism. Thatcher's turbo-capitalist Britain did not have a clue either!

The riots in France and the racial/religious tensions have complex origins which require thorough examination and level-headed policies. Nothing like the facile and ignorant commentary that is prevalent in this thread.

[BadgerAle]

While I tend to share Arnfinn's political views I think his faith in the idea of european multi-culturalism is probably due to what he wants to believe and due to a lack of experiance of living with large immigrant populations. Before I moved to southwark (borough in south london) I naturally tended to look at the positives of immigration, and while economically its good in many ways I don't now believe it's worth the breakdown of social identity that mass immigration creates. What is happening in france probably doesn't look like it would happen in Britain, but when the economy gets tighter and there's not enough jobs and the immigrant population (especially muslim as they have a strong sense of dislocated identity)reaches %30/%40 things could be different. The general feeling that 2nd generation immigrants may have is of lack of any strong identity- this leads to criminality, or latching on to extream religion. I hope this doesn't sound like racism- because i'm not- i just would rather the government had policys that meant I am poorer/out of work than to irreversibly change the nature of this society for the worse. Note that this doesn't mean I think immigrants are bad people, rather that these circumstance will always be likely to produce ghettoisation and social disorder eventually- its happening in france- the most multi-cultural country in europe it will happen in other countries when we catch up to french levels.

maybe someone can start a different thread where we can ponder why oh why Europe suffers from unemployment and poverty

[The once and future king]

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maybe someone can start a different thread where we can ponder why oh why Europe suffers from unemployment and poverty

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Yea, because when those pictures of Hurricane Katrina were beamed around the world, the whole planet could see that no one in NO was poor/unemployed.

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Yea, because when those pictures of Hurricane Katrina were beamed around the world, the whole planet could see that no one in NO was poor/unemployed.

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Go back to Econ 101 and learn what the word 'marginal' means.