open-limping from early positions

[newhizzle]

well im back up to 5/10 again, and while tonight the games have actually been very easy(and ive been running exceptionally well, up 160 BB for the night), i have been thinking about eliminating open-limping from early positions from my arsenal in tougher games

im thinking just throw out hands like JTs and QJs in games where im likely to be isolated if i limp, and make my minumim open raising standards(from early position) something like 77, KJs, ATs, KQo, and AJo, folding everything else

what do yall think of this?

[adios]

[ QUOTE ]
im thinking just throw out hands like JTs and QJs in games where im likely to be isolated if i limp, and make my minumim open raising standards(from early position) something like 77, KJs, ATs, KQo, and AJo, folding everything else

what do yall think of this?

[/ QUOTE ]

I really like this forum, lots of good posts including the one you made. Why include middling pairs like 77,88, maybe even 99? Often your hand is marginal after the flop and you're out of position with a marginal hand with few outs. JTs and QJs actually represent a very small number of starting hands. I'm not saying I disagree, just wondering about the reasoning behind these standards you've proposed.

[brettbrettr]

I think getting rid of these hands entirely would be giving up too much. Yes, be conscious of when the table has tightened and don't always limp if you don't think its a good idea.

Also, if you notice a lot of people getting isolated, and I never thought I'd advise this, limp-reraise some sucker.

[brettbrettr]

[ QUOTE ]
Why include middling pairs like 77,88, maybe even 99?

[/ QUOTE ]

All three of these hands are raises for me. 77 is close, I guess, but the other two aren't IMO.

[mtdoak]

Open limping is usually a big mistake, esp at tighter tables. Trouble hands include hands like JTs or QJs, but you can easily raise hands like KQo, KJs, and AJo and even ATo. Just keep in mind the texture of the table with this raises. At a looser table where you can expect 2-3 cold calls, it might not be a mistake to raise JTs or QJs in EP, but it would probably be a huge mistake to raise ATo.

If you are in a loose-weak table with lots of people limping in, then I see don't see a problem with open-limping drawing hands like suited connecters and small pairs hoping to flop a set.

Just be prepared to toss the hand if you don't hit on the flop.

In tighter games with fewer people seeing flop and more pre-flop raising, this is a good way to slowly bleed chips (or not so slowly).

Do you have a plan for getting raised/isolated then flopping top pair with medium kicker? Do you know if you'll bet/check-raise/check-call/check-fold?

If not, then you're playing heads up hoping to flop a straight or flush draw without any other real outs.

[Fat Nicky]

If you have confindence in your postflop play, tossing hands like QJs or JTs is a mistake IMO, unless a lot of pots are routinely getting 3-bet.

Plus, suited broadways are so much fun to play, you often flop all kinds of fun straight draws and flush draws.

[slavic]

[ QUOTE ]
If you have confindence in your postflop play, tossing hands like QJs or JTs is a mistake IMO, unless a lot of pots are routinely getting 3-bet.

Plus, suited broadways are so much fun to play, you often flop all kinds of fun straight draws and flush draws.

[/ QUOTE ]

??? Please join my 30 or 50 game.

You guys should know this, suited connectors, small pairs all need high implide odds. You are ddescribing game textures that don't have them, what should you do?

Actually this is not entirely true, some times one or two players give such good odds in themselves it's ok to see a flop, but normally you have position and can get in cheap.

[Fat Nicky]

[ QUOTE ]
??? Please join my 30 or 50 game.


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With all due respect, I am referring to small stakes games (5/10 and below). From what I have heard, the higher stakes games are much more aggressive and tougher, and yes, playing QJs or JTs is probably a costly mistake in those games.

In a game where you feel like you have an edge against most player, I don't see limping with these hands as an error.

[newhizzle]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
im thinking just throw out hands like JTs and QJs in games where im likely to be isolated if i limp, and make my minumim open raising standards(from early position) something like 77, KJs, ATs, KQo, and AJo, folding everything else

what do yall think of this?

[/ QUOTE ]

I really like this forum, lots of good posts including the one you made. Why include middling pairs like 77,88, maybe even 99? Often your hand is marginal after the flop and you're out of position with a marginal hand with few outs. JTs and QJs actually represent a very small number of starting hands. I'm not saying I disagree, just wondering about the reasoning behind these standards you've proposed.

[/ QUOTE ]

i actually dont know the specific reasoning behind this, i would be interested in hearing it, but i know a lot of people on this forum recomend raising these hands, i have found that they are easier to play postflop when you raise them and they do have showdown value against a smaller field, when you limp with them you are pretty much playing them for set value, also i do think 77 and 88 are close and depend on table texture(im more inclined to raise at a tighter table), but im pretty much always raising 99