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  #1  
Old 03-21-2005, 03:26 AM
radek2166 radek2166 is offline
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Default Bush signed it.

Bush Signs Bill That May Let Schiavo Live

28 minutes ago Politics - U. S. Congress


By JIM ABRAMS, Associated Press Writer

WASHINGTON - President Bush (news - web sites) signed emergency legislation sent to him by Congress early Monday to allow Terri Schiavo's parents to ask a federal judge to prolong their daughter's life, capping days of emotional debate over who should decide life and death.




"In cases like this one, where there are serious questions and substantial doubts, our society, our laws and our courts should have a presumption in favor of life," Bush said in a statement after signing the bill.


After flying back to Washington from his Texas ranch, Bush had waited at the White House to sign the measure permitting a federal review of the case, which could trigger the reinsertion of feeding tubes needed to keep the brain-damaged Florida woman alive.


The House passed the bill on a 203-58 vote early Monday after calling lawmakers back for an emergency Sunday session for debate that stretched past midnight.


The measured was backed by 156 Republicans to 5 who voted against it and 71 who did not vote; 47 Democrats voted in favor, 53 against and 102 did not vote. The lone independent in the 435 member house did not vote.


The Senate approved the bill Sunday by voice vote.


Republican supporters said the "Palm Sunday Compromise" seeks to protect the constitutional rights of a disabled person and rejected suggestions that political motives lay behind the last-minute maneuver.


"When a person's intentions regarding whether to receive lifesaving treatment are unclear, the responsibility of a compassionate nation is to affirm that person's right to life," said House Judiciary Committee (news - web sites) Chairman James Sensenbrenner, R-Wis. "In our deeds and public actions, we must build a culture of life that welcomes and defends all human life."


Many Democrats who opposed the bill said the congressional vote placed lawmakers in the middle of issues best left to state courts and family members.


"Today, congressional leaders are trying to appoint Congress as a judge and jury," said Rep. Jim Davis (news, bio, voting record), D-Fla. "If we do not draw the line in the sand today, there is no limit to what democratic principles this Congress will ignore or what liberties they may trample on next."


House Speaker Dennis Hastert, R-Ill. and others rejected the description of the brain-damaged woman as persisting in a "vegetative" state.


"She laughs, she cries and she smiles with those around her. She is aware of her surroundings and is responsive to them," he said. "This is a woman who deserves a chance at life and not a death sentence of starvation and dehydration."


Rep. Barney Frank (news, bio, voting record), D-Mass., rejected the notion that elected lawmakers could accurately diagnose her condition.


"The caption tonight ought to be: We're not doctors, we just play them on C-SPAN," he said.


House Majority Leader Tom DeLay, R-Texas, said the federal district court in Florida, which is open 24 hours a day, had already been informed that a petition would be filed as soon as the president signs the measure — with the presumption a judge will order that the tube be replaced.


"Time is not on Terri Schiavo's side," DeLay said. "The few remaining objecting House Democrats have so far cost Mrs. Schiavo two meals already today."


Even though the legislation paved an avenue for federal jurisdiction in the legal case, there was no way to determine in advance how or when a judge would rule — or even which judge would be assigned the case by lottery.





Lawmakers who left Washington on Friday for the two-week Easter recess had to make abrupt changes in plans, backtracking for a dramatic and politically contentious vote.

In a special session Sunday afternoon, Democrats refused to allow the bill to be passed without a roll call vote.

That meant a vote could not occur before 12:01 a.m. Monday — the start of a new legislative day. Still, the measure was handled on an expedited calendar that required a two-thirds majority to pass.

The House has 232 Republicans, 202 Democrats and one independent.

The legislation would give Schiavo's parents the right to file suit in federal court over the withdrawal of food and medical treatment needed to sustain the life of their daughter.

It says the court, after determining the merits of the suit, "shall issue such declaratory and injunctive relief as may be necessary to protect the rights" of the woman. Injunctive relief in this case could mean the reinserting of feeding tubes.

"It gives Terri Schiavo another chance," Senate Majority Leader Bill Frist, R-Tenn., said after the late-afternoon voice vote in a near-empty Senate chamber. "It guarantees a process to help Terri, but does not guarantee a particular outcome."

Frist also noted that the bill, responding to some Democratic objections, does not affect state assisted suicide laws or serve as a precedent for future legislation.

A Senate bill passed by the House is returned to the Senate enrollment clerk's office where it is printed on parchment and, when speed is important, driven immediately to the White House by Senate personnel. There, the White House clerk takes custody of the legislation and prepares it for the president to sign into law.

The White House made arrangements for Bush to sign the measure at any hour, although without fanfare.

The Democratic whip, Rep. Steny Hoyer (news, bio, voting record), D-Md., said his office was telling members to vote their conscience on the issue and there was considerable Democratic support for the bill.

Schiavo has been in a persistent vegetative state for 15 years. Her feeding tubes were removed Friday afternoon at the request of her husband, who says that his wife expressed to him before she fell ill that she did not want to be kept alive under such circumstances.

House and Senate committees at the end of the week issued subpoenas seeking to force the continuation of treatment, but that move was rejected by a Florida court.

Schiavo could linger for one or two weeks if the tube is not reinserted, as has happened twice before.

Republicans distanced themselves from a memo suggesting GOP lawmakers could use the case to appeal to Christian conservative voters and to force Democrats into a difficult vote. DeLay said he and other GOP leaders hadn't seen the memo and that he would fire any staffer who wrote such a document.
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  #2  
Old 03-21-2005, 03:50 AM
Cyrus Cyrus is offline
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Default Taylor-Bush series

Life of fetus --> worth preserving
Life of person in vegetable condition --> worth preserving
Life of human beings in Iraq & elsewhere --> worthless
Life of human beings on death row --> worthless

Somehow, in the conservative mind, all that is derived out of the Good Book.
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  #3  
Old 03-21-2005, 05:34 AM
MMMMMM MMMMMM is offline
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Default Intellectually Dishonest

[ QUOTE ]
Life of fetus --> worth preserving
Life of person in vegetable condition --> worth preserving
Life of human beings in Iraq & elsewhere --> worthless
Life of human beings on death row --> worthless

[/ QUOTE ]

Saddam wasn't killing Iraqis anyway? And lots of 'em, too? So the Iraq part of your line is dishonest, for to be fair you must weigh BOTH ways in which Iraqi lives would have been lost. Therefore you can't just fault the US for lack of concern over Iraqi lives. Hell, I'd be more inclined to say that we would have evinced a lack of concern over Iraqi lives if we hadn't deposed Saddam. But again, both scenarios must be weighed.

The US is also building democracies in Afghanistan and Iraq--a HUGE victory for human rights and for "the lives" of people in Iraq and elsewhere.

As for Terry Schiavo, her condition is at least somewhat debatable (as far as I, or you, know anyway). She might NOT be a complete vegetable.

[ QUOTE ]
Somehow, in the conservative mind, all that is derived out of the Good Book.

[/ QUOTE ]

Again, a statement both overly cynical and intellectually dishonest. You know good and well that not all conservatives derive their philosophies from religion, and you know that not all the things you listed above do all Christians favor.

You're no dummy, Cyrus. Therefore no matter which side of an issue you take, you really ought to have more respect for proper intellectual etiquette (in other words, don't overstretch your analogies, simplifications, or groupings).
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  #4  
Old 03-21-2005, 05:55 AM
QuadsOverQuads QuadsOverQuads is offline
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Default Re: Bush signed it.

Here's a fun one for followers of the Schiavo case:

Do a Google search on "Texas Futile Care Law".

This is a law which George W. Bush signed, as governor of Texas, which allows hospitals to withdraw life support from terminally ill patients -- against the wishes of the family -- once the family runs out of money and the hospital declares that there is "no hope" of revival.

It's being used as we speak (the Texas courts just balked and issued a temporary injunction to prevent a Texas hospital from using this law to turn off the respirator of a 68-year-old man -- you know, that thing that keeps him alive -- against his family's wishes, because the family had simply run out of money).

Such is the great "reverence for life" that Mr. Bush brings to the Oval Office.

Fortunately, however, our joke of a media can be counted on to completely ignore Mr. Bush's blatant hypocrisy and crass political opportunism, as it pretty much always does.

Hail to the Chief, rah rah rah, etc.


q/q
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  #5  
Old 03-21-2005, 07:27 AM
Cyrus Cyrus is offline
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Default Who\'s being dishonest here?

[ QUOTE ]
Saddam ...

[/ QUOTE ]

Hold it. What's Saddam got to do with it?? I posit a bunch of relations and you immediately start waffling. Each of the following propositions should be assessed. I say they're all true -- for the conservative mind. If you say different, explain why.

Life of fetus --> worth preserving
Life of person in vegetable condition --> worth preserving
Life of human beings in Iraq & elsewhere --> worthless
Life of human beings on death row --> worthless


[ QUOTE ]
As for Terry Schiavo, her condition is at least somewhat debatable. She might NOT be a complete vegetable.

[/ QUOTE ]

(The only issue of the four that you cared to address.)

I'm not in favor of being cavalier with human life at all! On the contrary, I'm in favor of the most extreme prudence. But this has been in the courts for some years now. Where else should such a case be decided? Not in the courts? In church perhaps? Or by some plebiscite?

What's the President and Congress got to do with this? Where will the meddling in personal affairs of citizens of the executive and the lelgislative branch stop? Why do you think that this does not create a dangerous precedent? Surely you cannot believe that pangs of conscience overwhelmend the Congress - or Dubya - and forced their hand.

And when was the last time that the GOP-ruled Congress and the GOP's President rushed to legislate, and to spend the better part of the night legislating, to save one human being's life? Not in matters of death row convicts or bombing runs in foreign countries, that's for sure.

My set of relations stands.
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  #6  
Old 03-21-2005, 10:48 AM
zaxx19 zaxx19 is offline
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Default Re: Taylor-Bush series

Life of human beings on death row --&gt; worthless

Hmm I think we have finally come to a point we agree on...

Lets take the child rapist/murderer recently arrested in Fla.

I admit to not caring one Iota for his life...while deeply caring for the life of Iraqi Kurds, Shiaa, women, non-elite Sunni, Christians, all of whom seem to be better off after the removal of Saddam..hey thats only like 96% of the population though so you got a point.
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  #7  
Old 03-21-2005, 11:36 AM
jaxmike jaxmike is offline
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Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 636
Default Re: Taylor-Bush series

[ QUOTE ]
Life of fetus --&gt; worth preserving
Life of person in vegetable condition --&gt; worth preserving
Life of human beings in Iraq &amp; elsewhere --&gt; worthless
Life of human beings on death row --&gt; worthless

Somehow, in the conservative mind, all that is derived out of the Good Book.

[/ QUOTE ]

Yet more ignorant drivel from a wacky neocommie.

This would be more like it.

Life of fetus --&gt; worth preserving
Life of person in vegetable condition --&gt; worth preserving
Life of human beings in Iraq &amp; elsewhere --&gt; worth preserving
Life of human beings on death row --&gt; worth punishing

If you are so stupid as to think that human beings in Iraq and elsewhere are "worthless" to Conservatives you are even more ignorant than Dead. I simply cannot see how you think Conservatives feel lives in Iraq and elsewhere are worthless. That's probably because its what the liberals think of the blacks and the other minorities and the elderly. Worthless, except for the vote. The only frightening thing is that there is more evidence to support my wacked out suggestion than yours. You troll.
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  #8  
Old 03-21-2005, 11:44 AM
jaxmike jaxmike is offline
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Default Re: Bush signed it.

you don't know what words mean do you?

the two things you are talking about are unrelated. do you see why?
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  #9  
Old 03-21-2005, 11:52 AM
jaxmike jaxmike is offline
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Posts: 636
Default Re: Taylor-Bush series

I think you can sum up the arguments like this. (as a generalization, i think this is more than fair)

Conservatives are in favor of executing guilty criminals.
Liberals are in favor of executing innocent children.
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  #10  
Old 03-21-2005, 11:58 AM
Utah Utah is offline
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Posts: 452
Default Re: Who\'s being dishonest here?

This is a tricky case. However, I dont really see alterior motives in this, although I could be wrong. Conservatives have been furious of this specific case for quite some time and I remember reading articles about it last year. I didnt see a single article that tried to tie this into a bigger agenda.

I have a lot of trouble with the legislature passing quick laws like this because it inevitably leads to bad laws. However, it is in the realm of the legislature to do so as long as the laws are constitutional. There is a strong check and balance on such activities as the voters are elected officals.

Did you not find this case troubling before the congressional action, even if you did not think action was warranted?
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